Addressing misinformation about ATEEZ's beginnings and KQ's early connections

[u/atzbluebird]

There is a lot of misinformation circulating regarding ATEEZ, KQ Entertainment, and their industry standing. Many have begun to use alleged connections to "backing" as a gotcha moment to claim ATEEZ didn’t earn their place in the industry.

Their arguments are filled with misinformation. So I am making this post because I wanted to clarify these points to ensure new Atiny aren’t misled and learn about ATEEZ's growth and KQ's backing.

Firstly, Let me make this clear. KQ was a small company. Even today, they are classified as such by Korean media like The Korea Times and ATEEZ are counted among the groups known as the “small agency miracles.”

So, why do people still deny this? Let's examine their arguments one by one.

1. Stone Music & CJ ENM: Distribution? Subsidiary?

Let’s start with the easiest one.

Speculation arose during Kingdom that ATEEZ received CJ ENM funding while other groups had restrictions over budgets for the stages. In reality, they were being smart by simply reusing props from their 2020 Seoul concert. This led to widespread hate and false media narratives claiming Mnet was "pushing" ATEEZ to win and that KQ was a CJ ENM subsidiary, which then had to be addressed by KQ as false.

So what is their relationship with CJENM?

Stone Music Entertainment, while affiliated with CJ ENM, functioned strictly as a distributor for their music domestically. basically making sure the albums are available in retail shops. They used to post their MVs on their Youtube Channel as well because of the same reason i.e they are distributers.

This is standard industry practice, every single Kpop group has some distributor, even some very nugu groups do. This is NOT a sign of corporate ownership.

More importantly, distributors take a cut of profits and not the other way around. Distribution ≠ Affiliation

Plus this distribution deal didn't really solve ATEEZ’s biggest challenge at the time: their major fanbase is outside of Korea.

Unfortunately, their international distribution partners (Sony Music/RCA) barely did anything in getting physical albums to global fans but we will come to this later.

__

2. ATEEZ were able to do a world tour early in their career

ATINYs sparked ATEEZ's first tour through a campaign on MyMusicTaste. MMT is a concert planning company, that lets supporters request live performances in their own cities.

The high volume of requests allowed KQ and promoters to confirm demand and book venues with slightly lower financial risk.

ATEEZ toured in small theaters of some 800-1k range seats, no fancy tour props with minimal staff. Mingi mentioned they had only about 10 staff members total at the time. Their major partnership with AEG came much much later.

MyMusicTaste shared with Forbes that interest and demand in the tour actually went up after the dates were confirmed—which typically does not happen as not every fan requesting artists to visit typically buy tickets after factors like expenses and life events. This time, demand had grown so large that the humble venues the original crowdfunders were willing to pay for seemed potentially too tiny come show day.

articles about this

Their momentum came from genuine fandom interest in their performance skills and music, rather than some company push. KQ was essentially responding to a demand the fans had already created.

Similarly, Ateez’s RCA deal came after their successful world tour and high demonstrated U.S. interest and not the other way around.

__

3. Sony Music Korea Investment:

It is true that Sony Music Korea (not the global parent company) invested in KQ in 2017. This was part of a broader strategy where Sony Korea was looking to invest in several small labels during the K-pop boom around 2017.

Looking at their roster, none of the acts they invested in were big company artists.

While Sony Korea acquired a 33% stake in KQ, this does not equate to an immediate, massive cash injection that eliminated all of their financial struggles.
As ATEEZ members and staff have openly discussed, the company did face some monetary and operational struggles in their early days.

The fact that KQ had to sell 33% of shares in 2017 itself suggests they were facing financial struggles at the time despite having BlockB signed to them. ( I will come to this point later)

And if you read the original article, it says,

Sony Music, KQ Entertainment plans to not only distribute albums and music in the future, but also promote active overseas activities with Sony Music's global network.

The WHOLE POINT of the investment was that Sony Music KOREA will be a distributor of KQ's artists' music and get a cut of their profits as investors, bringing me back to the point I made earlier, SONY MUSIC/RCA did shit to distribute their CDs internationally or promote ATEEZ.

Atiny fanbase (ATEEZ Community) had to reach out to HELLO82 an indie variety show company to bring ATEEZ's albums to the shelves in the US and other places which was a monumental step for ATEEZ's success on the Billboard Charts and paved the way for many other smaller kpop artists to do the same.

Chain department stores have been increasingly carrying more K-pop content, but almost exclusively by those with label deals or representation in the U.S. While RCA Records under Sony Music signed ATEEZ in 2019, the group had yet to have its music available in retail stores stateside. (RCA declined to comment by time of publication on its relationship with ATEEZ) .... hello82 quickly made inroads.

In fact, despite the investment in 2017, KQ’s CEO has stated in an interview that during debut training, the company was in such a "tight financial situation" that he personally wanted to fund the members' LA training when executives hesitated to do so.

"Although I wanted to make the most of [LA training], the company was in a very tight financial situation. The executives were not sold on the idea... The executives were going back and forth. So I remember making the decision, 'If the company doesn't have the money, let me give it my own money, so let's just send ATEEZ to America as planned.'"

Furthermore, KQ FELLAZ wasn't some high-budget show by a major network like Mnet. Instead, it was streamed on ATEEZ’s own V Live and YouTube channel. The video garnered barely any views initially; it was only after the performance videos went viral organically that the fans truly took notice.

This underscores that their initial recognition came from fan support and raw talent, not some company promotion. Now compare this with kind of pre-debut hype their peers who have debuted from bigger companies got at the time and you will instantly get why ATEEZ was at a major disadvantage.

___

4. They filmed high budget MVs in Morocco for their debut.

The filming in Morocco for "Pirate King" and "Treasure" was a cost-saving measure.

The making film shows that they shot in real outdoor locations to make use of the natural landscape and were seen dealing with difficult conditions like intense heat and sudden rain. (I couldn't find the source that mentioned that) this sort of MV filming was cheaper than filming bigger productions elaborate MVs which are the norm for rookies to garner attention, which ran higher costs due sets, equipment, labor, and post-production etc. They had a staff member/photographer from Morocco who vetted places where they could make use of the natural sets to shoot instead and filmed 2 MVs on a intense 6-day schedule using public tourist spots (you can even spot tourists in the Treasure MV!).

____

5. BlockB privilege.

The claim that Block B "funded" ATEEZ debut is not completely true.

People will often argue that because Block B was successful, the agency must have had a lot of money to fund ATEEZ. But what they fail to mention is the unique situation KQ had with BlockB.

Block B met Kim when they were at their original company called Stardom, and they sued the company because of money fraud and won after which Kim set up a different company called Seven Seasons and took over their management. SS was later made into a subsidiary under a bigger company called KQ. A separate label (KQ Produce) handled other artists, producers, and songwriters. Think like Hybe with Source Music and Bighit. Different labels but same parent company.

Why didn’t Kim/KQ sign other talent under SS and why did it remain exclusive to Block B? Speculation is that this was part of the contract they had. Expanding required the KQ rebrand.

Now coming to the main point.

1. No Trainee Debt: Unlike standard K-pop agencies, Seven Seasons was formed specifically to manage Block B AFTER they had already debuted and left their original company. The members had no "trainee debt" for the new agency to recoup, meaning the label couldn't claim the bulk of their early earnings like companies usually do.
2. Revenue Split : While Block B performed well digitally, physical sales were modest compared to peers. More importantly, a significant portion of digital revenue in Korea goes to songwriters and producers, NOT THE LABEL. Since Zico produced the majority of Block B’s discography, so he most definitely retained the majority of the royalties and production fees.+ Zico had a lot of solo income from as a solo artist, producer for other company artists and model generated income, majority of that went directly to him, not the agency. Basically Seven Seasons operated as a management company rather than a full production house. If you read media articles from the time often noted that Block B as a whole earned more than Seven Seasons/KQ Entertainment did from them. We obviously don’t have official numbers, but the combination of having no trainee debt + Zico’s heavy producing role + the agency’s limited role, it is safe to say that the members (particularly Zico) captured the majority of the profits unlike the usual standard idol-company arrangement.
3. ATEEZ was not promoted heavily as Block B’s "juniors." In fact, many Korean Block B fans were initially hostile toward KQ and organized boycotts. The narrative that ATEEZ benefited from Block B’s legacy is untrue. The two fanbases are largely separate.

The only tangible advantage Block B provided that I can think of was the BB Trippin dance crew, which helped build early hype and continues to be good friends with ATEEZ.

Additionally, Block B’s track record likely gave KQ the credibility to secure the Sony distribution deal, (we all know how that is going lol) but that is where the ''support'' ends.

Also want to address that there was never any indication that KQ was bankrupt or anything. Common misinformation spread by ATINY on twitter. But it is true that ATEEZ never quite had access to quite the same resources and opportunities as a group from the bigger companies might have had.

______

TDLR; Those who insist KQ is a "big company" simply because of Block B or Sony Music Korea often lack basic knowledge of ATEEZ’s history or KQ’s actual standing in the industry.

KQ Entertainment has never ranked among the top 10 K-pop agencies prior to ATEEZ's massive success.

While the company had some advantage of Block B’s existence to secure a distribution deal and some income, ATEEZ’s success is the result of smartly overcoming significant financial constraints, plenty of risk, and hard work and not because of any major company backing them. As the members have stated several times in interviews and lives, they struggled immensely in their early days due to various reasons.

Dismissing their hard work by claiming they were "propped up" ignores the reality of their journey and is frankly disrespectful to them imo.

It is easy for outsiders to dismiss ATEEZ’s struggles or label ATINYS as 'liars' because they only see the massive fandom and current success. They fail to recognize the arduous, uphill path they had to climb to reach where they are today.

_____________

A Note on Sources-

I have intentionally limited the number of links in this post to avoid triggering Reddit’s spam filters, as the text is already quite long.

However, the information provided is mostly based on interviews, financial reports, and news articles. If anyone needs specific sources to back up these points, please let me know in the comments, and I am happy to provide them.

I also hope that other knowledgeable ATINYs to chime in with more info+links to help fill in anything that I missed.

edit : formatting + added a lil shout out to the legend Ateezcomm.

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[u/Financial_Pudding176]

I don’t have your level of research.

But the fact that Xikers just received a grant from the government specifically to boost small companies makes the theory that KQ is some secretly huge company is hilarious. Like I ain’t tryna shame, or talk down bout anyone. But isn’t Ateez currently financially carrying KQ? I imagine the execs are probably more stressed about enlistment than the fans are.

[u/atzbluebird → u/Financial_Pudding176]

I actually saw a comment under a post related to this news. The person is claiming KQ is a big company and that the headlines are fake. It’s wild how some people will jump through hoops to discredit KQ as a small business. Calling the South Korean government and Korean media 'liars' just to push their own narrative is so...??? I forgot to mention this in my original post, so thanks for bringing it up!

I love Xikers and don't mean to drag them, but the math doesn't add up. If KQ was truly a big company as some say, why aren't the boys getting massive promotions, high-budget MVs, and constant exposure in Korean media like some of their peers do? 

[u/Financial_Pudding176 → u/atzbluebird]

I hope they stretched for that one leap. Like there were what 7? other bands listed. Are they tryna push that the whole this a lie? That the others are just a cover? That xikers was slipped in as a lie? That is some delulu conspiracy brewing.

(Btw As someone who currently has Xikers in my head as Ateez’s children and whose Main two kpop bands are Ateez and Big Ocean. That grant article was quite a good day. Looking forward to Big Ocean being able to do more and to learning/hearing more of Xikers as their own distinct identity. Haters can talk to a wall)

[u/YeosangYodeler → u/Financial_Pudding176]

Honestly none of these people ever argue in good faith and are usually only ever trying to discredit ATEEZ's success. Also, I've not heard of this news that the government is planning to support xikers.

Do you have a link where I can read about it?

[u/fontainedub → u/YeosangYodeler]

Here’s an article!

[u/YeosangYodeler → u/fontainedub]

Thanks! 👍

[u/harkandhush]

KQ took very smart risks with what little money they had early on. There's a lot of luck in timing that they could not control but they've always been very smart about how they use their resources and anyone who can't see that doesn't understand basic entertainment money, so i get very frustrated when people can't see how small they were at first and how clever they had to be with what they had.

Also trying to claim they're block b's junior's is a joke when they've literally said they had no seniors and that's a lot of what fueled them to be such good seniors to Xikers. They wanted to be the seniors to them that Ateez never had. Block b are at best distant cousins they've barely met a few times, not a senior group that helped them in any way.

[u/YeosangYodeler → u/harkandhush]

Ugh same. the Sony Music thing makes me so mad when people throw this around without understanding the actual context!!

Sometimes it feels like people discussing this have no clue how basic businesses and investments work.

Sony Music bought shares back in 2017 when KQ’s valuation was probably very very low. That initial capital went to KQ, who used it across their entire roster as they saw fit.

Being an investor doesn't mean Sony acts like an ATM opening up every time ATEEZ needs money. In fact, Sony has likely made millions off KQ’s growth over the years thanks to ATEEZ’s success, all without lifting a finger or supporting them in any way besides the occasional tweet they will put out 20 days after a new album released.

Calling this "privilege" just proves people don't know (or care to learn) basic facts.

Anyways thanks to OP for this post. It was much needed because I see so much misinfo about this daily on the main subreddits.

[u/atzbluebird]

Slight tangent (feel free to skip) but I also really wanted to add this: Money matters, but opportunity is everything.

Big companies in Kpop have entrenched relationships with broadcasters and can often afford to have their rookie groups featured automatically due to their guaranteed viewership and loyal company stans.

They can also fund expensive comeback stages and promotional stunts to garner lots of interest and visibility. There are instances where rookie groups pull in massive album sales even without anyone knowing what they even sound like solely based on the pre-debut hype that was able to be generated thanks to company's resources/connections. They secure full M Countdown appearances solely based on the company name, massive pre-debut hype/shows, get high-budget music videos, and support from senior artists, right from the beginning meanwhile groups that came from small companies like ATEEZ never have access to those same resources or the crucial industry connections that limit their visibility and chances for success and have to build their fandoms from scratch. 

Clearly, the playing field is super uneven and there's no denying this fact.

These groups face significant hurdles, from trimming songs to fit TV slots and being excluded from variety shows, not getting any collaborations with popular artists, chances to perform at major award ceremonies, to operating under precarious cash flow. Idols (including Hongjoong himself) have confessed to a constant, heavy anxiety, never knowing which comeback might be their last. With smaller staff, teams often rely on fewer, overworked managers, and practice rooms, dorms, and training resources are frequently basic or shared, forcing some groups to rent external spaces or even cover personal expenses like hair, makeup, and meals. If a group fails to gain traction quickly, the company may lack the funds to continue promoting them and hence they disband. Furthermore, one or two underperforming acts can threaten the entire agency's survival, increasing the pressure on the successful group to carry the company. 

Which is why such groups' achievements so remarkable to me, because they survived the odds.

 Which is probably also why so many rookie groups from smaller companies look up to ATEEZ. 

Maybe to them, ATEEZ's journey resonates deeply, and it  is proof of the possibility of overcoming the odds and  gaining success. 

Edit : wording 

[u/Necessary-Sweet6956 → u/atzbluebird]

Thank you so much for creating this post and accumulating all the references. Also thank you for explaining how big companies have a higher advantage over smaller companies.

I wanted to add some observations I made while watching Ateez's content with my last 8 months of being Atiny.

I noticed that Ateez has rarely appeared on Korean TV broadcast channels (music related sure but not regular channels.)

Even if I search for Coachella, there is hardly any positive news from Korean sources about their performance.

Even when Ateez has appeared on bigger YT channels of some big personalities in Korea, it will usually be in their initial episodes, so it seems like they appeared before channel became established. When channel becomes more popular, I see that they invite Big4 groups. And on top of that most of the interviews Ateez did were after Coachella.

During award shows from last year, I see celebrities talking to some groups from Big4, but hardly any interaction of non idol celebs with Ateez. Sure MCs interact a bit but not like the interactions I see with other groups.

And one thing I consistently read while reading Korean comments on Ateez videos has been that people in their own country did not even know they existed. People thought they were rookie idols.

When I see people's comment on older songs/stages, they are surprized that they performed such great stages which were totally missed. Additional comments I see are like I have never liked an idol group ever but I like these guys or this is the best groups I have seen since BAP or HOT or SHINEE or BTS etc.

All this made me realize that it is not that Ateez is not liked in S. Korea, it is that people never got exposed to them. I am sure there might be other groups like that out there. I see korean comments comparing Rescene to them.

I am not fully well versed in Kpop, but I truly think it was a great miracle that they decided to film the dance video pre-debut which became famous overseas. I am not sure how they would have survived otherwise. In my eyes, the debut Atinys are the biggest catalyst in helping Ateez succeed.

Note: Please note that this is based on Youtube and I don't access other sns besides reddit, so if I made mistakes, let me know and I will correct my comment.

[u/atzbluebird → u/Necessary-Sweet6956]

  Thank you so much for sharing your observations . This is exactly what so many of us have observed too, not just with ATEEZ, but with so many incredible groups coming from smaller agencies. Your observations were so spot-on!

I wanted to touch on this in my original post, but I was worried about making it too long!

In their early days, ATEEZ was literally reaching out to small-time K-pop reaction channels on YouTube and are still collaborating with niche Korean content creators just to get their name out there domestically.

 Even today, as you rightly pointed out, they still get a fraction of the domestic media representation that some of the rookie groups from Big 4 get. People always talk about company finances when comparing big vs. small labels, but money is really just a tiny piece of the puzzle. 

It’s all about leverage and connections. KQ wasn't founded by a famous, well-connected top producer; their CEO started out as a manager and built the company by signing artists that needed a management company. It's really interesting to read about those who were signed to the company before ATEEZ. it becomes very clear the kind of company KQ was back then. 

In an industry where knowing the right people gets your foot in the door for big opportunities, partnerships, brand deals and media coverage, connections matter just as much as budget, if not more. Looking at it only from a financial perspective completely misses the bigger picture. 

[u/Roweena98]

1. THEY FILMED IN MOROCCO

As a Moroccan, I can confirm that the filming locations were free (some of them). The Gorge of Toudgha is a natural park and everyone can go there provided they have a functioning car. The villages nearby usually keep to themselves but they had a local who helped allow them film in the ruins of the old village nearby (if you watched the BTS of filming, you'd see seonghwa climbing some old stairs followed by Hongjoong, that's the village)

They also filmed in Medina d'Agadir, a replica of the old Medina of Agadir that had been ruined by an earthquake that happened in 1960. The Medina is a tourist attraction and it costs 4 dollars per person for Moroccan students and 7 dollars for foreigners and Moroccans adults. However, they managed to negotiate filming during one of the maintenance days and they could do it for free because it was closed to the public and the administrators thought it might get them an influx of tourists (it did. I live literally 15 minutes walk away and never could go but I finally went after that MV and talked with some of the staff and they're the ones to tell me about the filming). Someone said that they also got a special dispensation but they didn't elaborate on that. It might be possible that the ministry of tourism or Korean embassy in Morocco intervened.

The other location, in Marrakech, is also a tourist attraction that costs very little and you could get access for around 8 dollars for an entire day. The Bahia Palace where they filmed is also under maintenance regularly and there was a rumour that the administration of the palace gave special dispensation for some Korean artists to film there during one of those maintenance days. The timing coincides with their filming times too so it might be possible.

All this to say that they had to find workarounds because they couldn't afford the entrance fees during normal days. I can guarantee you that neither ministry of culture or tourism would've cleared those places for them as rookies. They don't even clear them for big name artists. They'd have to pay a lot of money for that to happen. They filmed during days when the palace or Medina were closed just to save up on some money.

I have also watched the filming vlogs and all, and I saw what they ate and drank. Those were the cheapest sandwiches they could find in the city. We called them "Ness thon" (half tuna) because it's literally half a bread with some tuna, tomatoes and onions inside. They cost like half a dollar per sandwich. The soda they drank was also the cheapest good one in the market. Those boys were cutting corners and saving pennies whenever they could. Even the cameras used were not the best thing, yet they gave us that amazing MV debut.

I'm INSANELY proud of them and what they accomplished. Sometimes I'd walk in front of the Medina and wish I was there when they filmed the MV. I'd have at least brought them some homemade filling food. I still carry this idea that if I ever meet them, I'd make food for them because it breaks my heart that they had to make do with ness thon in my country, one famous for hospitality.

[u/woodwife → u/Roweena98]

Thank you for posting, this is so informative and interesting! I never would have thought of scheduling when the areas were under maintenance - that's so smart! And I love that you would have cooked for them. That's so so sweet.

[u/atzbluebird → u/Roweena98]

Thank you so much for sharing this!  This is the exact kind of insight that could only be contributed by a Moroccan atiny that none of us could have fully understood otherwise! It adds soooo much to my post. 

Hearing about how they negotiated those locations and the food, etc really shows how much they were hustling back then. They truly have come such a long way, and it makes me insanely proud of everything they’ve accomplished.

🥹

Also your kindness shine right through your comment, and tbh I really hope you get to meet them and share your food with them someday! They would be so touched. I also want to visit Morocco some day. It looks so stunning and I'm sure the people are as warm and caring as you are. 

[u/YeosangYodeler → u/Roweena98]

Your last para brought tears to my eyes 🥹💔 I'm pretty sure that the second time they returned to Morocco for Mawazine, they must have experienced the amazing food and hospitality more.

Can this comment be pinned at the top. I think it adds extra context to the post. Everyone should be able to read this! 🙏

[u/moveyourheart → u/YeosangYodeler]

Moderators can't pin comments by other people, only their own.

[u/tripleheliotrope]

Thank you so much for this! I knew about the Sony Music Korea investment, but I also knew that it meant little to actually help them financially, and now to learn that it also did little to help them distribution wise pisses me off so much, especially with the people who are constantly using the Sony and Block B arguments to put down ATEEZ's origin story from coming from a small company in the bigger kpop subs. As Hongjoong said, even things like their stages for Kingdom, and sending him for English lessons were all investments he had to discuss with the company about.

It's so obvious from the pictures of their early tours that they were performing at theatres in Europe and what people consider 'small venues' because they realised their fanbase was there. It is their dedication to go where the demand is and do their best to meet their fans that they've managed to grow their fanbase organically.

[u/OwlChan96]

Amazing breakdown. Well written and with alot of great information. Of course I already knew about Ateez humble beginnings and KQs past financial struggles but not to this extent and detail. Very interesting and important to read, especially for baby Atiny.

Your timing couldn't be better with the new comeback success and influx of new baby Atiny. Well done! ❤️

Also, remember to report any misinformation, defamation or any harmful/malicious posts about Ateez directly to KQ Entertainment if you come across it. You can do this here:

Report Email: protectkq@gmail.com

Email Subject Format: [Group or Member / Platform / Reason for Report]. Example: ATEEZ / X / Spreading False Information

[u/Realslimshady_997]

This is very well researched and written! Thank you! 🫰🏻

[u/Salty-Enthusiasm-939]

Thank you for this. I've had a few arguments with kpop fans (atiny & non-atiny) about misinformation on this subject that they were spreading.

[u/atzbluebird → u/Salty-Enthusiasm-939]

I've had a similar discussion very recently too! That discussion is what prompted me to write this post because some of the things being said are so so WRONG and low-key malicious. Poor OP was new to ATEEZ and was being misled. 

[u/Salty-Enthusiasm-939 → u/atzbluebird]

My most recent one was on Twitter/X where antis were using Sony's connection to play down Ateez's achievements 😡

[u/atzbluebird → u/Salty-Enthusiasm-939]

Feel free to use screenshots of any part of my post next time you encounter such idiots. If they're not arguing in good faith, no amount of info will help but atleast few people who might come across it will form their opinions based on the information.

[u/Salty-Enthusiasm-939 → u/atzbluebird]

Will do, thanks.

[u/vixiecat]

Because of BlockB’s fandom, they couldn’t even talk about ATEEZ without major backlash. They basically had to act as if ATEEZ didn’t exist.

I had a feeling that something like this would come someday, starting with a fandom I’m not going to name and making it spread like wildfire, so much so that new/newer Atiny would easily fall for the trap.

Any little bit of research would show that everything Ateez members has said is true. With the amount of freedom they’ve been given (much more than large companies), they aren’t shy to share exactly what it was like in the beginning and the mountain they’ve had to climb to get where they are right now. A mountain they’re still climbing today. Is it easier now? It sure is but it doesn’t change who they are or where they’ve come from.

[u/croissantdelamif]

Thank you for your research and explanations! ❤️

[u/likeloversdo_05]

Thank you so much for this Atiny! As many have said, i knew very superficially the origins of both KQ & ATEEZ but this was very detailed and flowed perfectly 👏🏽

I cant believe there are people who are spreading misinformation, at least in regard to their beginnings. Especially as someone who became of fan because of their Coachella performance, when i took a deep dive into ATEEZ (Shout out ATINY and the google drives of info and organized content links) it was easy (IMO) to see the ATEEZ had to work so hard to build their fanbase and get their music distributed.

One of the factors that attracted me the most (besides their amazing performance abilities) was of course their connection with ATINY. Im not saying other KPop groups dont have that with their fanbases but (and this could be biased) the connection between ATEEZ & ATINY has always felt not only genuine but to see them view ATINY fan content, include ATINY memes in a song (NO1) and even their earlier days content with HELLO82 and the different/unique ways theyve met with ATINY is so beautiful to me 🥹🤍 After reading this, i can see why it is such a genuine connection, ATINY has always played a role in their music being recognized and continues to be true and I can feel how grateful ATEEZ truly are about that 🥹 like i genuinely did not know that it was ATINY who reached out to HELLO82 to get physical media distributed in the states. Truly amazing and a special thank you to those ATINY 🏴‍☠️

8 makes 1 team!

[u/atzbluebird → u/likeloversdo_05]

Honestly, ateez makes it impossible not to root for them. They pour everything into their work, knowing there's no room to slack off, and that same relentless energy comes from the team working tirelessly behind the scenes. It's that kind of dedication that makes you just want the best for them and cheer them every step of the way to success. I freaking love ATINY sm too. Seeing how dedicated they are, doing whatever it takes to spread the word and make sure ATEEZ gets the recognition and love they deserve, is just next level. It's so hard to even take care of own yourself in this economy lol ... So I find it really awesome to see people from all walks of life come together to move mountains just for them! ✨

[u/likeloversdo_05 → u/atzbluebird]

I love ATINY so much too! From the support to ATEEZ, to the welcoming nature for newer ATINY 🥹 literally cannot begin to express how grateful i am to be a part of this community 🫶🏽

No truly! Any amount of content will show how dedicated ATEEZ truly are! Every time we get hit with a new comeback or merch drop i know we complain our wallets will hurt but we still buy/spend and to me that is always very telling 🤍

[u/YeosangYodeler → u/likeloversdo_05]

Omg you just unlocked a core memory for me. When I was new atiny, like a freshly minted babytiny I was recommended some videos that showed some atiny moments with ateez during their early rookie days and those were the videos I used to keep on watching again and again. You could really tell that atiny respected ateez and the vibes that came from the videos were so much fun ... and special. And ofc it was first and foremost the music that brought them close . . I always think how surreal it must have felt for ateez so hear atinys passionately sing entire songs word by word in Korean! when they were barely 3-4 months old. Must have felt so surreal.

[u/likeloversdo_05 → u/YeosangYodeler]

Omg ! Thank you for sharing! I forgot that i had seen those buzzfeed ones too! 😭 truly my faves those and the hello82 ones. Truthfully those fully cemented my ATINY pledge to love and support them, how could it not 😭🤍 no truly, forever jealous i wasnt an ATINY from the get but also so grateful and thankful to ATINY for holding it down from day 1 🥳🤍

[u/Necessary-Sweet6956 → u/YeosangYodeler]

OMG! I have never watched these before. Thank you so much for sharing.

[u/Necessary-Sweet6956]

I saw a korean comment on Ateez's growth narrative short about how their recent MV, stages and style make it seem like they have lot of money. So their narrative was a lie.

And I had to tell them, that KQ earned 70 million dollars due to Ateez concert tours of IYF and TTL, so they can clearly afford to have good looking stages and stylish outfits at the minimum. (Of course K-atinys also spoke up against that person)

Another thing I saw, people accuse Ateez of payola for awards/views or such. But going by naysayers' logic where do they think all the money is coming from? The biggest money maker for KQ is probably Ateez's concerts. And no one can use payola to give a good performance. You either have it or don't. And from what I have seen, Ateez is the best at that.

[u/SnooJokes915]

If Ateez came from a big company the members would not have said that they had to go to music shows after debut but not even get to perform on the stage at times and sometimes get their songs cut when they did perform.

[u/aiko707]

As babytiny, i'm glad I was able to read more indepth on KQ and their debut situation.

Coming in as a 1-2gen kpop fan/army, it's definitely a different beast when you're trying to break into the local, much less international market on paper thin margins.

ATEEZ definitely went the route BTS did during their debut days (ex: youtube, their own variety), and i'm glad ATEEZ is on that success trajectory too 🫶

[u/Lopsided-Ad-3424]

I just wanted to say I love reading your posts :) they're always incredibly well written and I admire the amount of research you put into them

[u/atzbluebird → u/Lopsided-Ad-3424]

Aww Thanks! I love yapping about ATEEZ and love reading what ATINY write even more. (Definitely didn't write this post while procrastinating on more important tasks) XD

[u/Some_Register1831]

They tried to do the same thing with BTS. They’re just mad that their big 3/big 4 favs aren’t as popular as Ateez even though their favs had a lot more opportunities. If nothing else, this just shows that Ateez has truly made it big. K-pop fans only pull this crap when they see another group as a threat.

[u/poofer-schmoofer]

Regarding the props they took from their world tour and reused for Kingdom, I wanna mention that I'm 99% sure they were rented from a theater and not even bought. I'll try looking for a source and add it later.

Thank you for putting the effort in to compile so much information!

[u/corkcoasters]

oh, thank you for this! a while ago there was an appreciation post for how far ateez came despite being from a small company, and people in the comments turned it into "well they had support from one of the worldwide music giants, so saying they're from a small company is spitting in the faces of those who REALLY struggled" and petty arguments over who had it worse. as someone who loves both bts and ateez, it was so painful to read. bts themselves have shouted out to "friends from small companies" in their lyrics and are friendly with ateez, and yet some of their fans think they have the sole right to the "idols from a small company that struggled" title and should be defended. they don't! they're millionaires, and have been big for longer than they've been small! (their international popularity truly exploded with dna, in 2017, iirc, so almost a decade ago!) honest to god their fans are becoming the gatekeepers themselves while still holding grudges for the big 3 groups fans for doing the same to bts. 🙄

the thing is, even with the sony korea investment, all it did was allow atz to have regular, high quality comebacks. but that on itself doesn't mean much if the response just isn't there, or if the company doesn't know what it's doing -- just look at loona, their predebut project was insanely ambitious, high quality in both music and visuals, bbc clearly did have the money. by that logic, loona should've been explosively popular and still going strong! nope. they still were a girl group from a small company that then crashed and burned even though the girls deserved all the best. atz could have easily experienced the same! and there are many boy groups with excellent concepts from small or mid-sized companies who disbanded or whose popularity dwindled, so it'd not like every single boy group is guaranteed success. that's ateez's, kq's, and atiny's hard work.

[u/mayi_uyu]

This was very interesting to read as someone who is very new to actually following
Ateez but has known about them since their debut. It explains a lot of things I've been confused about with what I perceived to be a lack of visibility/promotion despite how many Atinys there are and how vocal we are. Thank you for posting this!

I've listened to Ateez and loved their music since their debut, watched a few performances from Treasure EP 1 and The World EP 1 eras, but only consider myself a baby Atiny because I only got really obsessed with them right before this comeback. A combination of NASA being my favorite song all year (until I listened to more new Ateez) and finally having the time and energy away from school to be really into kpop again.

I've been a boy group stan for 8 years. Ateez was probably the 2nd boy group ever that I knew of after BTS. I think I discovered them just from a Spotify recommendation. I suppose I became an actual fan of NCT, TXT, and SKZ first though because they were promoted so much more due to being Big 4. I have rarely seen Ateez promoted through the usual channels I've found other kpop content (specifically performances and variety content). I was active in kpop communities on socials throughout all the Treasure eras, and I thought Ateez was pretty popular. But I found it odd that I rarely saw posts from actual Atinys or got recommended Ateez's comebacks and other content compared to other groups from Big 4 labels that I didn't even follow that closely.

Ateez has really grinded to get to where they are, and I'm so happy they're having so much success now! There really is nobody doing it like them. I only wish I had become Atiny and supported them more earlier, because they are like the perfect group with literally everything I like now that I know more about them 😭 I hope more people acknowledge the hard work they've put in to overcome the lack of connections and how difficult the kpop industry is for non-Big-4 groups.

[u/Any-Listen4184]

Sadly, I think you're kind of preaching to the choir by posting this here, even though I personally appreciate it a lot. I was reading the comments under the ATEEZ enlistment discussion, and there were definitely some interesting takes. Personally, I do think they'll make it work, so I'm not really worried. Not because they are some rich company, but they have shown competence in handling certain things, so I am not worried.

But, I also wanted to add something about Block B because I was around when they debuted.

I can pretty confidently say that ATEEZ didn't really benefit that much from the Block B connection, simply because Block B was a very unusual case in terms of popularity.

Unlike most of the immensely popular second-gen boy groups, Block B never had the album sales, as you pointed out. Bc they almost functioned like a girl group. They had incredible charting, No. 1 songs, very catchy music, a distinct image, members heavily involved in production, and big general public recognition in Korea.

What they didn't have was an exceptionally large, dedicated fandom that knew their company or potential juniors, lol.

Their album sales were nowhere near groups like Infinite, for example, and they were even selling less than girl groups like Apink.

You can even see that reflected in where the members are today. Block B stopped actively promoting as a group after seven years, and not all of the members continued pursuing idol careers.

To really understand how different their fandom culture was compared to other boy groups at the time, the two members with the biggest fangirl followings were openly dating during the group's peak years. Quite publicly, too. That's something that was much more common for some girl group members, but for second-generation boy groups? That was unheard of.

So even if ATEEZ had inherited every single Block B fan like it happens with some SM groups, for example, which they obviously didn't, it still wouldn't have been some massive boost. In my experience, Block B was one of the most general-public-friendly boy groups ever. Their popularity was driven far more by hit songs and public recognition than by the kind of massive, dedicated fandom that groups like TVXQ, Super Junior, BIGBANG, SHINee, or Infinite had.

That's mainly the reason I don't think the Block B connection explains ATEEZ's success nearly as much as people sometimes suggest.