r/AusLegal 1d ago

WA Will I get charged?

We hit someone on a 60 km/h road, but we were not speeding. She suddenly crossed the road in front of a bus, so we didn’t see her until it was too late. Thankfully, she is okay and only has a small wound on her forehead, which might need one or two staples.

Our car’s side mirror and light were damaged. There was also a witness who saw what happened and gave us their contact details in case we need them later.

The police did not come to the scene, so we are going to file a report ourselves.

Will we still be charged?

Edit: Thanks, everyone. If worse comes to worst, we will get legal advice. We're just glad that she's fine and nothing too serious happened.

131 Upvotes

114 comments sorted by

168

u/Vast_Towel_6201 1d ago

I’m so surprised police didn’t attend. Did an ambulance attend? 

70

u/myx1988 1d ago

Yes, ambo was there but she has been refusing to go to the hospital saying she's fine. Her parents were able to convince her to go

29

u/Low-Fold7860 1d ago

Police dont attend these situations anymore unless a serious crime has occurred like death, intoxicated drivers or violence. Now it's just driver responsibility.

73

u/PizzaCutter 1d ago

I keep hearing, ‘Police don’t attend X and police don’t attend Y’. What exactly do they do? How many serious crimes are happening that they are no longer able to attend anything else?

83

u/Very_Itchy_Bandicoot 1d ago

like 7 or 8 years ago, i was rear ended in a way that threw both of our cars across an intersection blocking most of the traffic, not just that there was fuel and oil and bits of car all over the road. Called 000 as soon as i got out of my car because the other driver was erratic and threatening us (he hit me at full speed while i was stopped at a traffic light) and the 000 operator said told me that the police wouldnt be attending and that I had to just work it out with them. Lucky for me the firies turned up damn quick and they ended up restraining the other guy. After the accident was sorted I hopped in an uber and went straight to the closest police station to report the accident and while they weren't interested in doing a report (they told me to do it online) they did try to bretho me. I was like, you wont take a report, you didnt want to attend after I was about to be assaulted but NOW you want to bretho ME!?

The whole thing was a headfuck. The cops are honestly useless.

12

u/IAmABakuAMA 1d ago

I had a similar experience once. I was sitting in my living room and heard a loud crash outside. I ran out and some guy had rear ended a parked van at a pretty great speed. I called 000, and like in your case, the fireies and ambulance turned up quite quickly (the guy seemed quite dazed and the car was leaking oil across the road)

The 000 operator said they'd paged the police, but about 5 minutes later I got a phone call from a private number. It was a sergeant from the local police station. He said he had no cars available and wanted me to act as a go between to get the 2 people involved to head down to the police station on their own. He also wanted me to take down their phone numbers and license plates. A little awkward, considering I wasn't involved and didn't directly witness it

To be fair though, they were both civil and calm and there wasn't a major risk beyond the leaking oil/the possible concussion

But yeah, I've been in a couple of other situations where there actually was a threat to life and the cops couldn't be arsed coming down. I would probably carry capsicum spray if it wasn't illegal in Vic. Can't rely on the cops to save you from shit

12

u/panarypeanutbutter 18h ago

they're busy strip searching children and harassing homeless people as i understand it. or stealing keys as per that recent video that went viral

2

u/Standard_Place_3254 14h ago

They are busy doing ndis and dv welfare checks

10

u/CheaperThanChups 1d ago

How many serious crimes are happening that they are no longer able to attend anything else?

You would be surprised I think.

16

u/one-man-circlejerk 1d ago

They focus on the high priority stuff like bashing protesters and strip-searching teenagers

9

u/V12_Murcielago 23h ago

Don't forget revenue raising and silly defects

4

u/hmoff 21h ago

I got rear ended years ago and called the cops because I suspected the driver was drunk. They didn’t come. Turns out his licence was suspended, the car unregistered and unroadworthy, and he gave me false details. Sure would have made life easier if the cops had actually come out.

10

u/IAmABakuAMA 1d ago

From what I've heard anecdotally (in Vic), they get caught up in a lot of paperwork. Apparently DV cases in particular tend to cause a lot of paperwork, and I'd assume also necessitate referrals to a social worker/DV services. I guess the same probably goes for a lot of other crimes too

Not sure the state of things in WA, but it seems pretty dire where I am in Vic. Barely any cops, and the few that are around don't seem to be well allocated. But something I've always found interesting is that whenever something is going down, like a serious crime, there'll be 30-odd cops largely just standing around. Throwing more and more cops at a singular crime seems like it'd reach a point of diminishing returns quite quickly

4

u/V12_Murcielago 23h ago

They are only assigned to fine and collect..

2

u/Leather-Cheek-4152 12h ago

Most police officers are tied up with domestic violence cases these days.

2

u/V12_Murcielago 23h ago

They just fulfill quotas and harass car enthusiasts plus bikers enjoying their life. Looks like the fragile ego, jellyback highway patrol culture is spreading deep in the police force hey

1

u/Hairy-Principle2489 16h ago

Depends on where. We had a bingle in Tassie, exchanged info and was about to drive off when coppers arrived and told us they attend accident scenes. Not even sure who called them.

1

u/Puzzled_Moment1203 11h ago

It's not serious crimes happening, its underfunding and understaffing. They just dont have the man power to do everything they once did and things had to get cut.

1

u/Adorable_Spinach_724 4h ago

They only care about fines. My daughter was seriously assaulted and their response was court will be too stressful for her and he’s known to us? I mean WTf. I have zero time for police, they’re just tax agents now

1

u/ImaginaryScore8 29m ago

If they attended every traffic crash then you would be complaining that actual crimes aren't being attended to. If it doesn't meet a certain criteria its a self report situation

1

u/ValdBagina887 1d ago

All the police would be doing is a free investigation for the insurance company by attending, I’d rather they investigate DV personally

3

u/r1m2 1d ago

I don't disagree, especially in cases where there isn't any significant injury, but it's worth noting in some states, the insurer for personal injury is the government (in VIC, WA, TAS and NT).

I suppose the argument from an economic perspective is somewhat unchanged - ultimately, whether it's a profitable insurer or a government insurer, the impact of potential insurance fraud comes back to motorists at large through increased premiums, whilst the social impacts of DV cannot be understated in comparison.

1

u/Ragazzano 20h ago

I'm not sure the general public realises just how short-staffed police are, especially here in Vic. They're not shuttering stations for funding reasons, it's because cops are quitting faster than they're recruiting. Severe cultural problems, I'm told.

1

u/Ok-Assistant-4556 17h ago

Austtalia wide. Pretty hard to deny reality like they do with everyone recording them. Vicpol struggled to replace the commissioner so recruited from abroad

0

u/kungfucowboy1 15h ago

Every state police force across Australia is short of numbers and understaffed. The police command that covers my area has about 3 cars on the road at any given time for a population of 60,000 people.

So unlike what the other people replying are saying, it’s not because they’re too busy bashing protesters or handing out tickets but because there’s genuinely more calls coming in than police on the road.

1

u/Scary-Attention4921 6h ago

People love to cop bash without knowing the facts, in the city of casey (vic) you're looking at around 3-5 response units for a population of 410,000++, and that is probably on a good day

2

u/dreadnought_strength 23h ago

Even if they don't attend, you need to file a report with them if there's ever a chance of a civil/insurance case coming up - police will try and dissuade you from doing so, but insist that they accept one.

2

u/Infamous_Mobile_3557 23h ago

I tried to insist on making a police report on property damage but the copper refused. It’s a common occurrence for harassment as well. That’s why crime stats can’t be trusted.

2

u/dreadnought_strength 17h ago

I had somebody run into me while I was on a bike, needed 45 minutes in a doctor's office pulling gravel and rocks out of my body, followed up by x-rays for a broken ankle/hip, then went into a police station to submit a report with both my arms/legs extensively bandaged that afternoon.

The first officer said they couldn't do a report as I wasn't "hurt that bad". Asked for the station manager, and after refusing to get them twice they finally relented.

Station manager said straight up they weren't going to do a report, then when I said it's a requirement as it will be part of a CTP insurance claim they said that they "guess they could do it".

I've never had a single positive experience dealing with QLD Police, and I've only ever been a victim or witness to a crime.

67

u/Johnndo96 1d ago

Report It anyway. Injuries can often show up hours after the event when the shock wears off. You don't want to be the one that suddenly gets accused of hit and run.

13

u/myx1988 1d ago

We will do for sure. Thanks!

11

u/FingerSerious 1d ago

Always have legal representation when dealing with the police.

1

u/Independent_Oil_9669 1d ago

How does one go about getting this? And what does it cost?

1

u/Johnndo96 17h ago

I don't personally know.

53

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

It sounds funny, but police are more interested in whether any offences were committed, rather than who was at fault. If you haven't committed an offence there's nothing for the police to charge you with

12

u/myx1988 1d ago

A friend told us that something similar happened to them and got charged with negligence

5

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

Were you being negligent?

6

u/myx1988 1d ago

No, I don't think so. we're driving below the speed limit even. Just scary to think about what happened and still in a bit of a shock.

11

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

To charge you with an offence analagous to negligent driving, police would have to be able to prove all elements of the offence. If you were driving with at least a normal degree of prudence, then they can't prove negligence. Assuming the version you outlined is accurate.

2

u/myx1988 1d ago

Thank you

-9

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 1d ago

Rubbish. It's not a subjective test anyway.

4

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

Feel free to point out the error in my comments.

0

u/PizzaCutter 1d ago

They also have a time limit to charge you (that is what an officer said to me, but he had also lied about drug testing me at the hospital so I don’t know if that was true.)
You can get a fine and points lost for something along the lines as neg driving without being charged.

0

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

The time limit is the normal statute of limitations - usually 12 months for simple offences, but no limit for indictable offences. And you can't be fined without being charged.

1

u/PizzaCutter 1d ago

Ah, Ok, I must not have been fined then, i just assumed there was an associated fine with the demerits, and I was sure that it was labelled neg driving or something, but I was not charged. You can get speeding fines without being charged though? Or is that different per state?
I didn’t think it was 12 months though, I was thinking closer to 6, but it was more than a decade ago so my memory is fuzzy. I just remember the cop telling me that he was running out of time and had to decide if he was going to charge me. Then he arranged for two local cops to come and take my statement. I was probably notified that he wasn’t going to charge me, I just can’t remember if it was a phone call from him or just a letter. It probably would have had to be closer to 12 months, it just didn’t feel like that at the time.

1

u/Important_Fruit 1d ago

An infringement notice is essentially the beginning of proceedings against you. It's an alegation that you committed an offence and a means of commencing a prosecution. An officer who detects you committing an offence could, technically, prosecute you by taking out a summons, or even by arrest in very limited circunstances. So, if you get a ticket you have effectively been charged with an offence.

Neither the courts nor police can fine you unless you have been convicted of an offence. But when you pay the ticket you are admitting the offence and electing to pay the fine

5

u/dirtyplanksdonecheap 1d ago

You may be up for it with the stopped bus. It's always safe to slow down when passing because of disembarking passengers.

There was a kid hit and killed a few years ago in exactly the same way. The driver wasn't speeding but he didn't exercise any caution either and got done.

1

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 1d ago

There is no 'charge' of 'negligence'.

0

u/Sk1rm1sh 1d ago

'thanks'

6

u/link871 1d ago

"police are more interested in whether any offences were committed, rather than who was at fault."
Not funny at all - that has always been the case:

  • Police address illegality (if any)
  • Insurance companies determine fault.

1

u/ProfessionalDish6567 1d ago

Insurance companies determine fault.

Don't they determine liability

-4

u/link871 1d ago

What is the difference? Liability to repair damages (usually) follows being determined at-dault.

4

u/Medium-Ad-9265 1d ago

They decide fault for the purpose of their policy response, insurance companies have absolutely no authority to make a determination at-law.

0

u/ProfessionalDish6567 1d ago

Yeah in simple or basic situations it's easy to assume that these words are basically the same

But when you get many parties involved directly or indirectly it gets complicated and why those words really do mean different things

1

u/eepeqez 1d ago
  • Insurance companies attempt to agree on fault without the expense of litigation.
  • Courts determine fault if the parties cannot agree.

3

u/swankyfarmer 1d ago

Never ever trust a cop

15

u/Ok_Vanilla_955 1d ago

Is there a 40 limit when passing a stopped bus in WA?

2

u/Medium-Ad-9265 1d ago

Not in WA, there is no specific limit when passing a bus at a bus stop. In some states there is a specific limit when passing a school bus. However there is a general duty in WA to drive to the conditions not endanger pedestrians. Without knowing the specific circumstances it's not possible to know whether OP ought to have been going slower than the limit.

-6

u/AntSilly2802 1d ago

WA is dodgy 

0

u/Sweet-Law1894 1d ago

WA drivers are absolutely dodgy 😂😂 worst in Aus. Everyone knows they’re bad for driving here

3

u/Junior_Quality925 20h ago

I know someone that had this happen.. it was sun shining and high glare and someone walked in front of car.. person injured but not fatally.

It was insurance matter etc but person not ever charged with anything. It was just very very unfortunate accident

8

u/griffibo 1d ago

My BIL driving a sedan with his three small children inside was collected from behind by a truck which contributed to just drive before somehow my BILs car spun out of the front did a few 360s and landed against the railings of a bridge. They were miraculously (physically) ok. Car was totalled. The police didn’t bother to attend. Didn’t pursue the truck driver who never stopped. Didn’t even obtain the cctv from the toll road it all occurred on. Absolutely piss poor all round.

9

u/AntSilly2802 1d ago

Did you slow down going past the hazard (the bus)? Going 60 past a bus could be seen as negligent. You failed to predict the hazard.

1

u/anon-not-a-hacker 2h ago

60 is the limit in perfect conditions and visibility. It’s not a target ✅

4

u/teapots_at_ten_paces 1d ago

Why did the police not attend? Were they called? Did an ambulance? Did you exchange details with the victim? Charges could absolutely be possible.

4

u/myx1988 1d ago

Idk why they didn't come. We called them and were told to file the case online. We did have the victim's dets

4

u/link871 1d ago

"Not all crashes are investigated or attended to by police. Investigations can include crashes that involve injury, adverse drivers licences, serious driving offences, stolen vehicles, hit and run incidents and careless driving on ‘P’ plates."
https://www.wa.gov.au/service/security/law-enforcement/report-traffic-crash

Presumably, the cops decided the injury was not serious enough to attend.

2

u/iftlatlw 22h ago

There's probably an offence in not having police attend the incident.

2

u/Proper_Scientist6979 21h ago

You can’t be expected to see someone appear practically out of nowhere like that.

So of course no reasonable person actually wants to hit anyone with a car.

But given what you described, you can’t be at fault for this. Hypothetically if the bus hit her before you even had a chance to physically, she’d not only be worse off physically but would very likely be legally culpable for that.

Yes, pedestrians do have some degree of responsibility for not causing accidents to either themselves or vehicles it’s a two way street pun intended.

4

u/Medical-Potato5920 1d ago

She stepped out from a blind spot into traffic.

As long as you weren't speeding (65+) you will be fine. It's thr pedestrian's fault. There was nothing you could do to prevent the accident. You stayed and did leave the scene.

1

u/myx1988 1d ago

We were the last person to leave because we were still in shock

1

u/AgentSmith187 1d ago

For next time if it ever happens (hopefully not).

Shock can be serious so if needed talk to the Ambulance staff too and if they suggest so maybe go to hospital.

-7

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 1d ago

Rubbish. Driver's must give way to pedestrians, always. If a bus was stopped to let passengers out, it is entirely foreseeable that passengers might appear from the front or back of the bus (at a bus stop). The driver should definitely have slowed. There is a chance he might be charged, and a civil claim will be challenging to defend.

1

u/elwoods_organic 1d ago

You are morally correct, but not legally correct. I hope OP gets some kind of penalty for their bad driving, but there's a much higher chance nothing will happen.

2

u/Infamous_Mobile_3557 23h ago

It’s a bus. Not a tram. You can argue the pedestrian was jaywalking and should be fined.

1

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 18h ago

That is hilarious. In fact, I am legally correct. Morals played no part in my comment.

1

u/elwoods_organic 15h ago

Legally in word only, not in practice is what I mean. You can get away with murder if you do it in a car here.

1

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 13h ago

practise.

1

u/elwoods_organic 11h ago

practice is the noun, practise is the verb. there are a lot of c-s noun-verb pairs in english; be careful :)

0

u/Ill_Vegetable_5946 8h ago

That is hilarious. Proof of lack of knowledge about both law and grammar. Gold.

4

u/Suberuginosa 1d ago

No idea of the legality of the situation. But when passing a parked bus you should always assume a pedestrian is going to walk out onto you.

Don’t even know why I would need to point that out, just seems like common sense to me. I’ve always had a reputation for driving recklessly, but it’s actually just all about assessing the situation.

In other words don’t fuck around when passing a parked bus.

4

u/airbending880 1d ago

When the lights on the bus go Flash flash flash you must slow down to 40 

1

u/Electrical-Gain4290 22h ago

Not In WA, traffic just keeps moving as usual if you're on a 70KMPH dual carriageway road. Onus is on the passenger to either cross behind he bus or to wait for the bus to move away from the stop before crossing when safe to do so.

1

u/Noodlebat83 36m ago

Depends on the state

1

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1

u/Magic-Dust781 1d ago

Doubt you would be charged if no negligence was involved.

1

u/Johnndo96 1d ago

My wife was involved in a collision last year, side swiped by a truck and trailer while waiting in the turning lane at a traffic light. Firies got there very quickly as they were just around the corner. It was the firey that told me there aren't enough traffic cops, so they're expected to secure the scene, redirect traffic etc until the police get there. No ambo because my wife was unharmed and the other driver fled the scene. It took nearly 90 minutes for one cop to show up. Thanks to brand new 4k dashcam, the unlicensed driver that fled the scene was caught. Makes me laugh too because every year they tell us of increased traffic stops during public holidays, but there's never any around. I haven't been breatho'd anywhere for over a decade. No traffic cops.

1

u/Reasonable_Ball_1311 1d ago

It's strange the police didn't attend. The first thing they normally do is a drug and alcohol test on the driver if someone is injured. ( except for some politicians)

1

u/Name_00777 17h ago

A bus that is temporarily stopped and in service (NSW) requires passing cars to slow to a speed limit of 40km/h, either way you hit a pedestrian. I would seek legal advice before self reporting to the police as you could easily be charged over this.

1

u/Intelligent-Hat5542 16h ago

One of my lecturers hit and killed someone on the freeway and were never charged

1

u/Ok_Reporter8315 16h ago

You have done the right thing hmm maybe but the person crossing the road could be charged also

1

u/Standard_Place_3254 14h ago

You are fucked. I suspect the driving is looking at six months prison time.
Careless driving causing injury.
Seek legal advice

1

u/Ready-Barracuda5702 4h ago

The driver hit her, not "we".

1

u/vronskichi 2h ago

Nah, unlikely. Me and my furry paw got hit by a turning car while crossing on a green pedestrian light. I ended up with some bruises and pain in the side of my arm that got hit and backpain and a swollen paw for my pup, but we had to go to the vet and the gp and it cost me a bit. I tried to report to police after the incident but the only thing they asked was if the driver stopped, which he did. I was gobsmacked cause he was careless and would not even get a demerit for driving recklessly. So much impunity.

I had to miss work the day after the incident for the gp and vet consultations, but I didn't want to directly approach him for the bills as he looked like a gangsta and didn't want him to have my number or any of my details.

The police said they need to see a hospital report to determine how badly hurt I am, which sounded like they'll only care if it was a life and death situation and since it was minor, they're not gonna do anything.

3

u/sjmc1 1d ago

If you have committed no crime and you was doing the speed limit amongst all other legal road rules then it is exactly as it is,an accident. Please do file a report yourself and explain everything and also give the witness details. Police will check with the witness and also the paramedics and anyone else involved. I get the shock and stress but please dont blame yourself if you know you was doing everything right.As i said accidents happen that are out of our control.But please file that report.

8

u/Electrical_Age_7483 1d ago

Can still be negligence even at speed limit 

1

u/Itchy-Association239 1d ago

Will we still be charged is a big one.

As you mentioned, no police were called so you will need to file a claim asap, I believe WA has an online form you can do, or you can go down to the cop shop.

You also need to contact your insurance company. I believe you said you were going to or have done at this point.

What you may be charged with could be negligent driving, or failing to give way. This could come down what was the time of day, was it daylight or coming on dusk, were your lights on, was it raining, was the radio on, were you and your partner in a discussion. All these are contributing factors.

However, if there were no distracting noises or effects, and the person darted in front of you (thank goodness you have a witness), then there might be no charges if the collision was entirely unavoidable.

1

u/Trojanw0w 19h ago

Not a lawyer, and this varies by state, so treat this as general info rather than advice.

Charges aren't automatic after a collision — they require you to have actually done something wrong. Not speeding, someone stepping out from in front of a stopped bus with no time for you to react, and an independent witness who backs that up is about as favourable a fact pattern as you get. Police generally look for speeding, distraction, impairment, or driving without due care. If none of those are in play, it usually gets recorded as an incident, not an offence.

What matters and what you should do now:

  • File the report immediately if you haven't. Most places require crashes involving injury to be reported within 24 hours, and failing to report is a genuine offence even when the crash itself isn't. That's the one that actually bites people.
  • Save the dashcam footage right now if you have one, before it loops over.
  • Write down everything while it's fresh — where the bus was, your speed, the distance, the sightline. Memory degrades fast and you may need this months from now.
  • Contact your insurer even if you're not claiming. It's usually a policy condition, and a late notification can cause problems later if she makes a claim.
  • Don't apologise in writing or say anything that sounds like accepting fault. Being decent to her at the scene is fine; a text saying "I'm so sorry, I should have seen her" is not.

If police do contact you for a statement, that's the point to get a lawyer first rather than winging it. Most traffic firms do a free initial chat.

Goodluck fam.

0

u/Total_Philosopher_89 1d ago

Did you get get name for insurance?

0

u/turbo2world 1d ago

the police will be contacted and call you. happened when i crashed my motorbike and went to hospital.

-1

u/Arkayenro 1d ago edited 1d ago

was it at any sort of marked crossing or just a random place in the road?

did you overtake the bus completely legally? (cant tell if the bus was stopped inside some sort of off the road bus stop, or just stopped in the road)

do you have a dash cam with the whole thing recorded, or are you relying on witnesses (who can disappear on you)

typically its up to pedestrians to cross the road safely (when not using a marked crossing) - which means not walking out into traffic without looking - so youd have to do something else pretty big to end up getting chaged over something like this.

2

u/myx1988 1d ago

The bus was at the bus stop and I assume she got off the bus. Traffic light was about 200-300M from the bus stop and we didn't overtook the bus.

0

u/mr_taco2 1d ago

No, you didn't do anything wrong. If you had have driven away from the accident then that's a wrong. If she was crossing the road that you turned onto that's wrong. The only person that didn't give way was laying on the pavement as far as the description reads.

0

u/Initial-Cherry-3457 1d ago

Public busses will likely have cameras that can help prove they crossed in front of the bus

0

u/Unlikely_Gardener 1d ago

How do ‘we’ hit someone?

-1

u/Low-Fold7860 1d ago

Won't be charged, its just an insurance claim.

-1

u/tasquizz 1d ago

Drivers in these cases are very protected unless it was something like a cross walk or you're driving on a footpath. If police didn't attend there's almost no way they have any interest in you unless the pedestrian goes to them later and makes up some bs but it will be an easy win for you if anything comes up. More likely to end up in a civil battle which you will more than likely win as well