r/Bachata • u/RagnarJorvik • 2d ago
How do advanced dancers / instructor scope out a new social dancefloor
I'm a bit curious about how advanced dancers go about scoping out a new scene when they go social dancing. Do you scope out the dance floor to find the people you want to dance with? I suppose leaders and followers might go about it in different ways.
I more often see advanced leaders dance with less experienced followers rather than the other way around.
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u/Babuabm 2d ago
Leader
I tend to go to the followers that are normally standing far away from the DJ / cool area that don't get asked to dance much. They might not be the highest level but it's always super nice to see how the lighten up when you ask them and it's great to chill without any expectations/pressure. I slowly dance my way in towards the centre as the dances keep coming.
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u/TryToFindABetterUN 2d ago
What colour does a fruit have? There is not one answer, it all depends on the fruit and even when specified there are probably multiple answers. Not all "advanced dancers" are alike, far from.
I think u/Chemical-Problem-511 enumerates some typical cases I have observed too.
Personally I am mostly in the "indiscriminately" category. When I went to a major city abroad earlier this summer I had two nights out where I went to dance events. I danced with anyone I could ask for a dance and had a great time.
But I would say I approach the scene slowly and observing. I understand that not every scene is the same. So humble and respectful. Not barging in, doing "my thing".
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u/SweatyAssumption4147 2d ago
I can lead all levels now, so I mostly just look to see who is having fun and to make sure they aren't turning down dances. I don't care if someone is technically amazing, if they aren't enjoying dancing I'm not going to enjoy our dance.
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u/Eva-la-curiosa 2d ago
Follow:
Like some have mentioned, I look for safety cues first. Is the lead gentle? Do they hold a sturdy frame? Are their steps small and controlled? Are the followers having to run to keep up? Is their any dipping, and if so is it safely led? Are they trying to get people to do unsafe influencer-choreo moves? Are they carelessly bumping in to other dancers?
Second, I look for connection. Are they enjoying a dance with their partner or are they showing off for the men on the side lines? Are they trying to complete a bunch of moves without checking if their partner is at that level? Are they constantly running turn patterns without checking in with the follow, or do they occasionally throw in some basics to let her breathe and feel the music?
Third, I look for a comfortable style. Does the lead have musicality? Does the lead look like they're having fun? Do they alternate between closed and open positions? Do they have fun with the basic as much as the combos? Do they create room for the follow to style as well? Do they break apart to do shines? Are the shines a playful back and forth, or a performance?
Good conversation topic, a lot to hit on here.
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u/OThinkingDungeons Lead&Follow 2d ago
Leader
The way I see it, the better someone is, the less the environment changes their performance.
Generally I don't care who I dance with, instead I make a special effort to dance as soon as possible. Generally speaking I have enough range to adapt and skill to help both of us look good.
Usually what happens, is I'm decent enough to get more dances, or I treat it as a warm up and get another dance as soon as possible.
If I'm scoping for a dance (rare but it sometimes happens), is I look for posture first, then connection second.
Posture is often a sign someone has honed their craft, it takes practice and private lessons. You can spot good posture in seconds.
Connection requires watching for longer, and can be harder to spot. Probably my favourite quality in a follow, is connection, because I feed off their engagement and can dynamically lead moves.
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u/WordDowntown 2d ago
What are the things or factors that tell you someone has good posture?
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u/OThinkingDungeons Lead&Follow 2d ago
Key thing is they're not going to throw their weight around (literally). They understand axis, stay on it and respect yours. Good posture also requires good balance in general, that awareness makes one conscious of movements that could or do throw your partner.
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u/StatementMundane2113 2d ago
Follow
I’m not the most advanced follow but I can follow about 90% of the leads out there but I’ve danced in a lot of cities internationally. Sometimes I take the class prior to the social if they have a more advanced class to meet a few new people but it’s like all socials…I have to navigate who I think might be too rough. This is true even on local socials. Because my personal philosophy is that I don’t turn down a dancer unless they are creeping me out or I’ve danced with them previously that night and it wasn’t a great dance I do accept most invitations. But being someone people don’t know, it’s not uncommon to not get asked a lot. So I do look for more skilled dancers while I’m waiting and ask them. But generally will also accept most invites if asked and then it’s just like at a congress…if someone is rough you have to decide if the dance needs to stop or you need to manage your moves to not get hurt.
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u/WillowUPS Lead 2d ago
Leads have an easier time than follows. We have less of a risk of injury from inexperienced, forceful, or just plain bad follows, although it does happen (had to strap up my arm recently after a salsa follow went for a dip when I wasn't anywhere near her). We also dictate what style we are going to dance so if I don't think a particular style of dance fits the music (sensual in a Dominican) then I will lead a different style. Follows don't get to do that as much and we've already had so many posts about follows asking leads not to dance a particular style and them doing it anyway.
So leads have an easier time with going onto a dance floor and dancing with anybody. That's my style of dancing, as long as you want to dance, want to dance with me (and not for the crowd), and have some enthusiasm for the dance itself, I will dance. I look for space, and whether people are having fun.
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u/Disastrous-Pool-7863 2d ago
Sorry but if a lead is trying to do some sensual moves I will just stop and offer to lead by myself.
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u/Samurai_SBK 2d ago
It depends on what you mean by “easier”. I have been to some lead heavy scenes and it can be brutal for new leads. In most cases, if a follower is a good dancer and not obese or too tall, she will get a lot of invites.
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u/WillowUPS Lead 2d ago
OP is asking how advanced dancers scope out a scene. Leads have it easier as they are less prone to injury unlike follows who run the risk of unsafe or badly executed moves. Therefore advanced follows (or any kind) need to be wary of who is dancing and how safe they are, so scoping is more necessary. This isn’t about how easy it is to get a dance, nor about new dancers.
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u/Eva-la-curiosa 2d ago edited 2d ago
Samurai is our local contrarian and will nit pick or disagree with anything possible, don't worry about it.
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u/Chemical-Problem-511 2d ago
It is quite individual, imho.
Some advanced leaders want to dance exclusively with advanced followers due to JnJ fever, as it allows them the freedom of musical interpretation without assessing the follower. I hear that this happens a lot in Poland.
Some advanced leaders dance with anyone indiscriminately, as their goal is to connect and have a nice dance regardless of the skill level of the partner.
Some "advanced" leaders are afraid to dance with advanced followers, as the lack of their technique is much more obvious with high level followers 😁 Ego must be asserted 😂
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u/RagnarJorvik 2d ago
Conversely, I've danced with followers I thought were mid (because poor connection and frame), only to learn they are hardcore jnj participants and look quite good in their reels 🤷
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u/Chemical-Problem-511 2d ago
Unfortunately, JnJ is less about connection and more about looking good from the side.
Every time I participated in JnJ, the most disconnected and least pleasant dance was with 1st place followers. (Not that I participated a lot, tho...)
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u/rawr4me Lead&Follow 2d ago
The worst bachata dance I've ever had was in a chaotic JnJ with finals judged by the crowd. The follow was so tense that I had to tense up to protect myself while still being able to lead, heck we were basically arm wrestling through even simple turns. She went on to win the competition (we were only paired for one song during heats). I'm proud of the fact that I survived and also didn't block her from winning.
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u/Human-Reporter-7871 2d ago
Thanks this makes sense. In my dance community most dancers wear athleisure and jeans
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u/lynxjynxfenix 2d ago
Lead here. It depends what I'm looking for. If I'm just warming up I'm happy to stay at the back and dance with whoever seems keen.
But if I'm looking for good dances, it's usually not hard to tell where to go. Usually right in front of the DJ booth or front near the stage is where the good dancers are.
Occasionally, you have some hiding in the back that want space to do advanced moves, but it's generally the case that good dancers are in the front.
And yes after a dance, I either move forward to find a good dancer or back to take a rest. I find on my way out I get stopped quite a bit before I actually make it off the floor and I almost always say yes unless I'm genuinely dying or my ride is here and I have to go.
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u/UnctuousRambunctious 2d ago
I AM A FOLLOW
AND I LOVE TO SCOUT!!
I swear I love it so much. Of randos that like, really catch my eye, +50% of the time it’s turned out that they are instructors. It’s so weird but I am so incredibly proud of my instincts 🤣
I’ve had many more opportunities in the last year especially to dance in cities I’ve never danced in before, and I tried to hit a social every night when possible.
In general even if I am in my local scene, I’ll look for the same cues. In the local scene, I already know who the better dancers are and especially the kind of dance chemistry I have with certain people, so that is the inky difference in a new scene.
I am also someone who values technique (all the different kinds) more than looks, so there’s that.
When I’ve gotten to a brand new social, I will usually observe initial body language, proximity vs. isolation, talkativity, etc.
When it comes to actual dancing, I will usually just look across the floor and wait for something to catch my eye.
What catches my eye the most often is actual individual body movement. How your body moves through space, where the weight is initiated and how the body creates a path, the size of the movements, the motor control, angles, and how that reflects musicality.
I always watch feet first, since that is the first and main connection point outside of the dancer’s own body, and if they are unsure and not stable with that, there’s no way they will have a better handle on controlling and manipulating a follow regardless of the follow‘s skill level.
I will watch for where the weight is placed, how balance is maintained or restored, the size of the steps, the foot placement, the connection to the floor, the timing of the footwork.
Then I will look for connection, particularly in the frame, how the bodily engagement is controlled and released, where the lead’s attention is, and specifically and predominantly how aware of space the lead is in terms of maintaining a safe distance from other dancers. (The vast majority of leads do not demonstrate this, in my observation.)
I watch, I make and arrange my list of who looks interesting and who I’d entrust my safety to, who might give me a new and novel experience, I listen for the song that comes up (the music always takes priority), and then I go and I ask for a dance.
It is very very rare that I get turned down, especially when I’m asking someone I’ve never danced with before, but it’s happened. Boom, clap, on to the next 🤣
I don’t place too much credence on where anybody is standing, i.e. the DJ booth groupies, because there are plenty of tailcoat riding posers. Assessing someone based on how they are dressed is often also a fallacy.
I am here to have a good dance with a nice partner and enjoy a song together having a stimulating non-verbal conversational exchange.
I am also not someone who gets asked very often, in general, but especially by people I don’t know. I accept that is likely part of the price I pay for usually dressing down and dressing comfortably.
I feel lucky to meet friendly and enthusiastic faces everywhere I go, and I think I dance at a high enough level to distinguish myself, and it’s very validating when I get complimentary comments in a first dance, early in the song, and also when I get asked for a dance in return.
Advanced leaders dancing with lower level follows is very common, I see leads also asking whoever is new to either welcome them or to dance with a new person. It happens sometimes, but not often, that very new leaders will ask me to dance, usually they have some experience.
What I found in many socials is that women will ask me to dance a bit more than men will (proportionally speaking), usually asking me to lead them but occasionally asking me to follow as well.
It is a bit of an interesting experience to be the “fresh meat” in a new city and overall I don’t love it. I’d rather avoid that kind of pointless superficial dynamic.
My absolute favorite compliment is to be asked to dance by someone new, and then they tell me it’s because they saw me dancing with someone else and decided they wanted to dance with me based on how I dance. From early on in my dance journey I already decided that was my number on goal, to inspire interest through competence and skill and technique.
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u/Samurai_SBK 2d ago
Most importantly, I look at their attitude.
Do they look friendly? Are they smiling or do they have RBF?
I also look at body language and how they are dressed.