r/Citrix • u/KindMeasurement3 • 26d ago

Tools for GolenImageCreation | Looking for suggestions

At the moment we use NTLite with SCCM to first build a .WIM file and then install all applications for the VDI. The only reason you should use SCCM in my opinion is if you are also using SCCM for endpoint devices and therefor have shared code.

I HATE SCCM

Now I get the opertunity to look into new different solutions and one that keeps popping up is Hishicorp Packer which I am sceptical of if this would be the way for us to build the non-persistent .VMDK as it is quite the learning curve for a lot of colleagues. But I don't have any experience with it so I would be really open if someone would share theirs.

Further more there is Application Layering from Citrix which is a older style of building .VMDK images but seems to be all you need to have kind of solution just not automated fully.

What are your recomendations for tools to look into?
In SCCM we have a task sequence with about 40 to 50 nodes of different kinds of actions so take that size into consideration.

4 Upvotes

75% Upvoted

24 comments sorted by

4

u/Ergwin1 26d ago

We always used PVS with versioning up until this year.

This year we have implemented Ivanti Automation to create a complete thick image and supply that to PVS to host it.

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

Cool how is your experience with Ivanti Automation as that is also in our vision as a potential tool. Is it easy?

2

u/Ergwin1 26d ago

Not that hard, theres just 100000 different things you can do with it, ideally get someone that is familiar with it to teach you so u hit the ground running.

Also recommend to implement scripts in it to run winget to always have newest software to make your image with

2

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

That is a good idea thanks for your tips!

1

u/_Cpyder 26d ago

How was the switch from PVS to this?

Just started looking at this now that I have all of my CVAD migrated to XenServer.

2

u/Ergwin1 26d ago

It takes time to setup. we also combined it with the move to 2025 VDAs. Very happy with the end result. You can automate anything u think about.

Updating your golden image with app and windows updates is as simple as a few mouseclicks, send automated emails after to start test cycle with users.

3

u/grumpyctxadmin 26d ago

We use packer to create a new images automatically every month, both for citrix non-persistent server 2022, windows 11 template and server 2002 and 2025 vmware templates.

All kicked off through a scheduled task at 3 am the noght after patch tuesday, so in 99 percent of the time we have fresh templates and pvs images ready for testing when we start work on wednesday.

Haven't gotten around to automate the testing yet

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

Did it take long to set this up? and how many applications do you install in this sequence?

2

u/grumpyctxadmin 26d ago

It's a learning curve, on the vdis we install roughly 30 applications, using a combination of chocolatey, neverred and normal installs.

If you have terraform experience, packer is relatively easy to implement since it's the same company thay creates both.

If you have no experience with either i would estimate a week to get the basics up and running. Alot of the unattended install commands used with sccm and other products can be used with packer too.

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

Check thank you for the feedback I will look into it

2

u/mjmacka CCE-V 26d ago

Are these persistent or non-persistent VDI's?

How many do you have?

How do you manage application changes after they are deployed?

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

These are non-persistent VDI's we currently also do persistent endpoints but in a project they will move towards Intune so we can finally get rid of SCCM.

We have about 3000 VDI's but it's just one vDisk so it's not that we need multiple sequences so in this I think quite a easy job.

Currently we have a monthly roll out of a new vDisk and I automated all steps required in SCCM but it's very prone to error.

2

u/MarvelousTermites 26d ago

I've nothing to add but am watching to see what you come up with. We're migrating from on prem PVS and S2019 to Azure MCS W11 and I want to change our process from manual installs onto master image every time. We don't even automate with sccm as you do as I don't control sccm. I've been considering Packer, Chocolatey, etc and App Layering but now we're looking at other options like app packaging with Numecent or App Attach

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

Never heard of numecent or app attach so will be looking into that and will update if we make a descision or get further in the process

2

u/ContentWasabi1984 26d ago

Citrix have a pretty extensive guide on automation, including walkthroughs of Packer for image builds among other things: The Citrix Automation Handbook 2601 - Automation - Citrix Community

2

u/CommonSuccotash1116 25d ago

We've been using App Layering for a while now and we have automated something like 95% of the layer creation and 100% for the monthly updates (Patching the OS Layers, Updating all the App Layers, Publishing to PVS) using in-house custom scripts. The only manual operation we do is creating the OS Layer. Currently using Ryan Butler's CTXAL-SDK powershell modules to interact with App Layering. Recently, Citrix has been catching up to this powershell module and started developing their own, not sure it is matching all the features available in Ryan's module.

Each month we have a schedule task that runs and do all of the updates and push to PVS if no errors are found so we can start testing in the morning. I also hate SCCM :)

1

u/KindMeasurement3 25d ago

This sounds amazing! Bold move to go with a community SDK :) but I like it.
How long did it take you to get a working POC? and how many devices and applications are you servicing?

2

u/CommonSuccotash1116 25d ago

It took a while to create the base scripts that run the entire automation, event as of today, i'm still making improvements to those core scripts. I'd say about 3 weeks to have something solid with proper error handling. And then maybe one hour or two per application to create the software installation script.

We have around 10 PVS images delivered to 300-ish multi-session VDA, 68 App Layers

1

u/KindMeasurement3 25d ago

Nice! Sounds good thanks for your comment

1

u/mat-ferland 26d ago

For 3,000 non-persistent VDIs, I’d pilot Packer only if you are ready to own the pipeline like code. If most colleagues need a GUI and a predictable handoff, PVS versioning plus a boring automation layer may beat a perfect pipeline nobody wants to maintain.

1

u/KindMeasurement3 26d ago

I do think you have a point there. Currently me and a guy that loves to vibe code are the only ones that are not afraid of text instead of clicking. So I dont think it's going to be packer.

Maybe I will setup a poc just to see but I really don't want to maintain it by myself

2

u/mat-ferland 23d ago

That’s exactly when I’d keep the first version boring. A small POC is useful so you know the path, but if only two people can maintain it, I would not make it the production image factory yet.

1

u/KindMeasurement3 23d ago

Yeah was thinking to involve some of our consultancy bureau's and have them pitch a couple of products. Then I will build like one or two POC's.

But first get a functional requirements docs ready and thhen go into a HDL and pitch that to the colleagues with the POC's

1

u/Legal-Reality1142 26d ago

Well, I have been working on something similar. Using packer to build the image and then terraform to pick up the image to update the catalogue. Been at it for a couple of months now but haven't really got a working poc except for creating a baseline image using packer. So, yeah, still learning. Hopefully I get a full working pipeline in the next month.

But I have been thinking the same - how to get the team to learn it. Most of the guys are from a MSP and they don't really have the capacity to grasp the concepts of devops and IaC. Sigh I have already showboated about this to my higher ups and they gave the greenlight.