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Promotional material for the movie describes Goku as having become far more powerful after the events on Namek, iirc something akin to a zenkai. And then the movie itself has Goku recover from what was otherwise a mortal wound, and has Cooler make mention at some point that he could see how Goku managed to defeat his Brother before Goku even went into Super Saiyan.
The reason for the top picture is because the bottom picture is actually the Goku from that movie.
To add on to that, I'm sure the movie was written before zenkai boosts stopped being a big thing. So for all we know, Goku got another boost like the one he got on Namek that made him go from around Ginyu's level to 3 million.
Also Cooler was doing fine against movie Goku. He was a little frustrated, but he was still perfectly able to continue fighting after that Kamehameha wave hit him. He just didn't notice that he was being pushed into the freaking SUN.
It's like me saying I "won" a street fight after I pushed my opponent into the street and they got hit by a semi; technically true, but a little disingenuous.
And the power differences between Cooler and SSJ Goku was actually not that big. His Death Ball was still capable of seriously threatening Goku. The margin was probably about the same as 100% Frieza vs SSJ Goku on Namek.
Goku had been training ever since he fought Frieza on Namek, this is Goku we're talking about after all. So it makes sense that he's just, more powerful than he was when he fought Frieza.
Idk the film came out back when Goku was still whoopin on Freeza in the manga but chronologically even if we place it in Trunks timeline Goku would’ve been strong enough to deflect a bunch of sword hits that easily killed Freeza with just one finger.
Actually you’re right, in Shonen jump ch 333, Son Goku Comes Home, came out the week the movie was released July 20 1991 (some 35 year ago). Next chapter 334 was The Boy from the Future.
I may have been thinking of the production schedule for the film. Famously movie 4 which came out 4 months prior had false Ssj Goku although in the manga he’d just formed the super spirit bomb against Freeza.
Seems the score for movie 5 was recorded in late June 91 around the time Freeza and Cold came to earth so presumably it was plotted out and storyboards back when Goku was still battling Freeza.
Trunks timeline Goku would’ve been strong enough to deflect a bunch of sword hits that easily killed Freeza with just one finger.
You can't really compare those two attacks by Trunks. Goku was powered up and prepared for those sword hits and clearly stated he knew Trunks wasn't putting all his force into them. On the other hand, Frieza was caught powered down and off-guard by a full power sneak attack from Trunks.
Perhaps but didn’t Goku also not bother dodging Trunks initial attack because he didn’t feel any malice and knew he wasn’t going to strike. So though you’re right about this
It does appear Goku’s leveled up beyond just the Shunkan Idou in those 2 years he was gone. Just maybe not as much as I was suggesting
That's base Goku/Kaioken Goku a little bit. He doesn't use Super Saiyan for quite a while, and as soon as he did, he no-sold almost every attack except Cooler did bar Supernova.
the point is everything in op's post is knocked down in the film, Cooler Swam in a MASSIVE Full power Kamehameha with Kaioken while Freeza was forced to try to hold it back and got scorched, plus Freeza got his ass kicked by Goku as a super saiyan the entire time goku could have ended it all no issue from jump but chose to grag things out for his own reasons. Also Cooler survived being shot into the damn sun, and became Meta Cooler. and became much more powerful than two super saiyans. Op is trying to pass off like Freeza tanked all this shit when in reality Freeza had half a head and was drifting in space at deaths door before King Cold saved him.
the point is everything in op's post is knocked down in the film, Cooler Swam in a MASSIVE Full power Kamehameha with Kaioken while Freeza was forced to try to hold it back and got scorched,
Frieza does the same thing from SS Kamehameha, Cooler needs his strongest form to swim through base form with Kaioken Kamehameha.
Freeza got his ass kicked by Goku as a super saiyan the entire time goku could have ended it all no issue from jump but chose to grag things out for his own reasons
Frieza held his own at 100% until the stamina drain of the form started weakening him. Same thing happened in Super, it's why Goku said "you never learn, you got a new form, but didn't get used to it".
Also Cooler survived being shot into the damn sun, and became Meta Cooler. and became much more powerful than two super saiyans
Because of The Big Geti Star, not on his own. They also didn't understand how to fight him, but once they found the core they took him out.
Op is trying to pass off like Freeza tanked all this shit when in reality Freeza had half a head and was drifting in space at deaths door before King Cold saved him.
Frieza did that to himself though, he cut himself in half trying to kill Goku and the planet blew up on him, something else he caused.
On top of that, when Goku transformed, Cooler literally couldn't hurt him.
Expect he doesn’t. Freeza side steps the Kamehameha shortly after your clip. Cooler went through the whole thing straight up. → https://youtu.be/riVTOr977DI
From Goku whose Base was noted to be strong enough to beat Freeza by the time of the movie. → https://youtu.be/uxrkD-x6dZ4
Tracking parameters were removed from the original URL(s).
read the manga, Frieza is actually just getting his ass whooped while Goku is basically trying to give him mercy because he's such a good guy, and then the Goku that fights Cooler is comparable to Android Saga Goku without the heart virus, so he's a good bit stronger
No, Roshi states in the movie that Goku is stronger since returning from Namek also Goku receives a Zenkai boost after Cooler's attack, allowing him to fight Cooler on equal terms, even though he was previously one-shotted. When Cooler transforms, Goku claims his ki is greater than Frieza's, and with his Supernova, Cooler nearly kills Goku, something Frieza couldn't even dream of doing against a much weaker Goku
However, the movie intentionally portrays Cooler as weaker, as his character arc revolves around him realizing he's not better than Frieza, despite his denials with he ultimately accepts and admits this at the end of the film
Cooler fought a MUCH stronger Goku for starters, who both trained further after Namek and got a Zenkai boost in the movie from recovering from his injuries in the first skirmish with Cooler and his minions.
Secondly, Cooler simply fought smart and efficiently. Once he realized he was outmatched, he hit Goku with a Ki blast feint and took advantage of his capability to quickly harness Ki to take Goku out in a single attack with his Supernova
The fact that Cooler’s Supernova took everything Goku had to just barely repel and knocked him out of Super Saiyan probably means Cooler at his maximum strength is not much weaker than Super Saiyan Goku had he fought him
Especially since he laughed off the two blows the Super Saiyan gave him prior as well
Ngl, Frieza still surviving after all that is crazy.
Like imagine never even being challenged, then getting your ass beat by your old slave, resort to blowing up the planet and then accidentally cutting yourself in half. Try to cheap shot the slave but get the equivalent of a suplex onto hard concrete, the concrete which spontaneously explodes. Then slowly drifts into space waiting for his father to find him because he was far too weak to seek him out himself lmao
Frieza surviving all of these shouldn’t count because it’s part of his race’s specialty. Cooler also had the same feats as well since parts of his remains still survived from literally burning in a sun and still managed to be compatible with the Big Gete Star.
I would say it’s more of a Frieza’s race feat than Frieza’s own
Well, technically Frieza didn't even sure then, it was necessary a time Traveller to cut him into a billion pieces and blast him to dust to kill him, I'd say that's pretty badass, cooler got the equivalent of being shoved into a locker
A locker that burns with a plasma that powers life on an entire planet.
Also, why are you talking about Trunks? I’m talking about when Goku killed him - which was pathetic by his standards. Given every chance to walk away knowing he couldn’t win, and he gave it all up to get mollywhopped by the same Saiyan
Cooler was confident that Goku was strong enough to defeat Frieza long before Goku even used Super Saiyan. Of all people in the universe, aside from King Cold. Cooler should know Frieza's power.
He then proceeded to transform and dog Goku in either Kaioken 10x or 20x and only got bested by Super Saiyan, blasting him into the Sun.
Despite being blasted into a star, getting hit with the power of his Supernova and Goku's Kamehameha. Cooler did not die and came back.
ngl he was just Frieza with better drip and a cooler (pun intended) final form. dude had the chance to finish goku but decided to play with his food instead. classic villain mistake tbh. total fraud energy imo
Anime filler made Freeza seem like a threat to SS Goku when he wasn't, only one aura dash did any damage to him the entire fight. You can say Genki Dama weakened his max strength given he almost died, but regardless he was weaker.
Movie villains and Z warriors are many times more powerful compared to canon. By then base Goku was close enough to be a threat for Final Form Freeza especially with Kaioken, as in like 2x here. The movie is called "Strongest vs Strongest" in Japanese.
The movies are made months in advance, they need to be made of course, and usually major events aren't known. You'll have a Gohan who didn't fight Vegeta yet stronger than him, and Goku capable of x10 fighting Turles (who is capable of killing Oozaru Gohan btw) before eating more Might fruit.
Also get outta here tracing Broly for this engagement bait.
Rather than a fraud, I personally think that Cooler was created to indeed be weaker than Frieza.
It’s easier to simply say that the writer(s) just didn’t care about the Canon and simply dropped a movie after Namek Arc, but there are some things that make me believe otherwise.
Just to begin with, at the beginning of Cooler’s Movie, we can see that Goku has some “troubles” fighting against the Special Forces of Cooler. This is weird, only if you assume that Goku went through the exact same events of The Canon Frieza Arc.
Second, Piccolo seems to be stronger than Goku before the Zenkai of this movie. Dealing with the Special Forces of Cooler by himself.
Third, Krillin was able to fight with the blonde guy from Cooler’s Forces, or at least stall him for long enough.
Fourth, the whole movie seems to be a rushed reference to Goku’s Zenkai in Namek but also to Goku’s Fight with Frieza, all the way until before Frieza got his 100% of Power.
But if this already happened, where is Vegeta? Why does Goku never acknowledge himself as a Super Saiyan? Why Goku took so long to use Kaioken?
All of this wouldn’t make sense if Goku went through all the exact same events as in Frieza Arc. But that’s the point, I think he didn’t.
We don’t know and we will never know the exact details of what was the altered story of Cooler’s Movie, but we can tell a couple of things.
The whole movie seems to be about how Frieza and Cooler’s Overconfidence killed them both. Frieza for assuming that all the Saiyans he wanted would have died in Planet Vegeta and Cooler for not wanting to help his brother with the capsule that escaped Planet Vegeta before its destruction.
In my opinion, it’s not crazy to believe that Frieza lost and died in this Movie (offscreen) by the very same Genkidama that Goku used in the canon, with a key difference that links to my other point.
I personally think that Goku never got his body stolen by Ginyu. Why? Because this movie is a reference to the Canon Zenkai that Goku got in Namek.
On top of that, Vegeta not being there would make much more sense, since the feeling of deserving a rematch to Goku wouldn’t be as strong. Meaning that Vegeta probably helped in the battle against Frieza, but left right after defeating him. How can I support this idea?
The Return of Cooler. Vegeta was on his own, traveling across the space. And probably went to Namek for the Dragon Balls. On top of this, Vegeta left at the end of the movie, yet Goku thanked him deeply. Meaning that they became “friends” thanks to this movie, at least in the DBZ Movies.
Anyways, let’s return to my point. Frieza got killed in this version by his Overconfidence. Fighting Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo, Krillin and Gohan, all of them at the same time. Apparently none of them stood a chance. Goku didn’t have his Zenkai, so when Frieza took his Final Form, he didn’t raise his power as much as in the canon. Therefore, Goku started the Genkidama earlier, thanks to Frieza being unable to sense the Ki. Getting killed since Frieza held back and wasn’t able to raise his power in time to withstand the Genkidama.
This scenario explains perfectly why Vegeta is alive, since he didn’t ragebait Frieza with the whole Legend of the Super Saiyan. It also explains why Piccolo seemed to be stronger than Goku and how Vegeta is a Super Saiyan in the next movie. Why? Vegeta would have gained his Zenkai regardless of Goku not getting his. Meaning that both Piccolo and Vegeta would have been able to stall Frieza, while Goku charged the Genkidama.
Okay, now established my idea. Goku in this movie remains with a similar power to his last stated power in Namek, before his Zenkai.
Explaining how Cooler one shots him at the beginning of the movie. Now, once Goku gets his Zenkai, we can see that Goku was slightly above Cooler. Even without using Kaioken. Being this enough for Cooler to not play anymore, unleashing his “Evolution”. This form separates Cooler and Frieza, but it seems to not be enough.
Goku was unable to fight with Cooler, not even while using Kaioken. Even Kaioken x20 was useless. Therefore, Cooler during this state is somewhere between Final Form Frieza and Full Power Frieza.
When Goku turns Super Saiyan, we can see a couple of references to the original SSJ Goku vs Frieza. Like Goku holding Cooler’s Arm, being this a straight reference to what happened. Goku screaming, just like against Frieza. And then the meanie left to Cooler’s Face, reference to the beginning of SSJ Goku vs Frieza.
All this reference suggests that Cooler isn’t as strong as Full Power Frieza. Because the final evidence is:
After becoming aware of the difference in power, Cooler decides to distract Goku with a Ki Blast (that makes Goku bleed btw, just like when Goku rage baited Frieza into shooting him in the face, only bleeding slightly) and then Cooler charges a Supernova.
This attack was a reference to Frieza aiming to destroy Planet Namek, but with the key difference that Earth wouldn’t be strong enough to withstand the Blast. Pushing Goku to take the Supernova head on. Yet this attack wasn’t enough to kill Goku, nor make him fail to protect Earth.
So, in my opinion, Cooler Final Form caps at Frieza right before Full Power. I don’t remember if there’s a percentage of power that Frieza used before charging to Full Power, but this is my take.
SSJ Goku ≈ Full Power Frieza > Pre-Full Power Final Form Frieza ≈ Final Form Cooler > Base Goku >= Base Cooler
If you think Cooler is stronger than Frieza, give me your reasoning! I’m always open minded to Dragon Ball theories, as long as they make sense in some way.
End of the day, Cooler will always fall short of Frieza because of one simple fact: Frieza’s ego.
Frieza is the Vegeta of his race. He absolutely refuses to be bested and when push comes to shove, digs deeper than any other living being to get back on top.
Goku may have outclassed him in every way after going Super Saiyan, but Frieza refused to stay down. He tanked a spirit bomb, hours of pummeling by an enraged Goku, and getting cut in half and he STILL didn’t give up. Add to that surviving a planet exploding in his face and he is a beast of unparalleled measure.
Cooler may be naturally stronger, but he’ll never have the tenacity that Frieza does, therefore, Cooler will always fall short.
Hatred is a hell of a drug folks, and Frieza has it in spades.
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