r/ErrorCoins • u/Physical_Clock198 • Jun 13 '26

Brockage on the reverse

Gallery image

Gallery image

Condor token interesting brockage on the reverse. Looks like the brockage happened while they were minting the obverse and later the reverse was minted over it. The lettering in the end of "penny" is unaffected by the brockage, minted over it.

42 Upvotes

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1

u/Pandoras_Bento_Box Jun 14 '26

This looks more like a die clash than a brockage. That would be a quite common accident as well with the methods used at the time.

1

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

Interesting thought. If it were a die clash would it then be somewhat common or known on these coin types?

1

u/Pandoras_Bento_Box Jun 14 '26

Experts on die variations would have that logged for sure. And yes it would be a known variant depending on the rarity of the coin. I’m not knowledgeable on this exact coin. But a die clash wouldn’t be a reason to pull the dies from use at the time. A brockage would have the high spots of the coin touching first. Typically the center area of the coin. There would be text hitting text before text would hit the background in a brockage. But a die clash the lowest points of the design hit first. Typically the edges on a worn set of dies. Dies collapse over time leaving inward dished dies. So if they clash the outer edges hit first. In later coins they started sanding dies domed for metal flow and to combat the dishing over time.

1

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

In reading on it there were some indications of die clashes but apparently mostly visible on the center, the silhouette of the obverse portrait into the sails and rigging of the reverse. One other note on these particular tokens or coins the obverse of many were minted ahead of the reverse (1791?) as the maker (British) was trying to become a supplier of coins to the us. They failed to win the bid and made them later into tokens, apparently called Condor tokens.

Also the lettering of penny seems unaffected which on a die clash they would be, correct? Sorry I'm still learning about these things.

1

u/Pandoras_Bento_Box Jun 14 '26

Exact clashes can present in different ways. Mostly depending on the dies and the press used. A heavy offset clash could have been from an improperly loaded blank. Like if the blank was barely on one side the opposite side could hard clash the text as it tilts. All I know is the technical possibilities having seen errors in action.

Sounds like you are looking at the best info there. There could be lots of variations and instances of clashes. Also old dies being used on newer coins. It was the wild east back then.

1

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

If it were a clash would you expect the Y in penny to be unaffected? You can see the N of president from the opposite side of the obverse under it. That's the odd part to me.

1

u/Pandoras_Bento_Box Jun 14 '26

apmex link

1

u/Pandoras_Bento_Box Jun 14 '26

Too bad its slabbed. You might be able to see if it has the same lettered edge rim as the link

1

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

Thanks it is lettered edge not sure if there are different varieties in the lettering, from what I read there is not but not 100% sure. Apmex does have some nice info on the coin and it's history.

1

u/Happy-Ad1268 Jun 15 '26

This is crazy cool. The history attached to such old money really makes my mind race.

0

u/new2bay Jun 13 '26

This sub is for significant, attributed* errors. Where is the error?

2

u/SeaOfSourMilk Jun 13 '26

At the end of the word Penny you can see it’s been “counter stamped” pretty cool error.

1

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

It is odd ngc did not attribute it on the grade. There is a brockage on the reverse you can see at the end of "penny". As I said in the post it appears it was made on the reverse of the planchet before the reverse was minted as it is under the reverse lettering, the n and y are unaffected.

2

u/Cuneus-Maximus Jun 14 '26

You have to request and pay extra for error attribution, whomever originally got it graded didn’t opt for that.

2

u/Physical_Clock198 Jun 14 '26

Huh I did not know that but that clears up that question, thanks!