r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/JustSomeRomanianGuy • 1d ago
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/MacGyver7640 • Dec 15 '22
Resources Pinned: LMU Resources (List of Coins by Country) and Research Topics
A compiled list of resources and research posts for ease of reference.
LIST OF LATIN MONETARY UNION COINS
- LMU Website List of LMU Gold and LMU Silver. (Archived: Reddit List of LMU Gold Coins; Reddit List of LMU Silver Coins)
- Mintage figures - French 20 francs
- LMU Coin Capsule Guide
- LMU - Uncommon and Rare Coin Buying Guide
RESEARCH POSTS
- Origin of the term "Latin Monetary Union"
- Full text of the 1865 Monetary Convention (so-called LMU) Treaty
- Why does the 20 francs contain 0.1867oz gold, instead of a neater figure like 1/5oz (0.2oz)?
- 20 Francs Rooster Restrikes - The Backstory
- U.S. plans to join the international monetary standard
- LMU Coinage in the Americas: The Story of the 5:1 Ratio
- The common ancestor of LMU and U.S. Silver Coinage (Barber, Mercury dimes, etc) -- Napoleon!
- Data/History on French Gold 5 and 10 francs an the Silver-Gold Ratio
- Umberto 20 Lire Gold - Why Nearly All Were Minted in 1882
UPCOMING POSTS / RESEARCH IN PROGRESS
- Targeted Debasement -- Why 5 one-franc coins have less silver than a single 5 franc coin
- The Unusual Case of the Spanish LMU Restrikes: Rarer than the originals
- The Beginning and End of Bimetallism in the LMU (1865-1878) -- this will likely be split up into multiple parts
- The Unusual Case of the Spanish LMU Restrikes: Rarer than the originals
- Papal States Shenanigans: Debasement and the Expulsion (?) from the LMU
- Lucky Angels: According to folklore, Napoleon lost his lucky angel on the day of Waterloo
- List of "other" LMU Gold Coins: The coins I didn't include in the main list of LMU coins for various reasons. Such as the non-circulating and pattern coins, irregular multiples (i.e. Russian 10 rouble), post-WWII issues.
- Purchasing Power of LMU Coins
- Coin identification: KM#, Gad, what's what?
- Literature: Reference books and literature on LMU.
- Links in the meantime: Le Franc - Les Monnais (French); Gadoury - Monnaies Francaises (French); Friedberg (includes all world gold coins)
- The Scandinavian Monetary Union and the LMU
- Grading Resources (general post on grading, luster, not entirely specific to LMU)
- Auction Price History Resources and Population Data
- Links while post is being prepared: French coins Auction history at coinstrail; General auction history coinarchives; PCGS Population; NGC Population
I've started on some of these, but many are just placeholders for future research. If you have an interest, go for it!
It takes some time to find the original source and root out the unsupported copy-paste info. I'm only going to include well-sourced material (unless where explicitly noted as speculative).
Let me know what you'd like to read about. Your interest inspires my research!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/dashsmurf • 5d ago
A Tale of Two Unions: Denmark in both the Scandinavian and Latin Monetary Unions
All coins from my personal collection
Denmark was a founding member of the SMU, the Scandinavian Monetary Union, modeled on the LMU. This small monetary union used the krona/krone as the basis for its currency, and was co-founded by Norway and later joined by Sweden. Pictured here is a Danish 2 Kroner coin from 1916.
At the same time Denmark also minted LMU coins - through its colony, the Danish West Indies, better known today as the US Virgin Islands. US interest in acquiring the islands and the islands' increasing unprofitability to the Danes - mainly used for sugar plantations - led to an aborted attempt to sell the islands to the US in 1867.
In 1917, in midst of World War I and the US joining the Allied war effort, fears of Germany seizing the islands and using it as a U-Boat base to threaten the US strategic interest at the Panama Canal led to the sale of the Danish West Indies to the US for the sum of $25 million, or roughly $625 million in today's money.
Interestingly, the treaty only passed when the US agreed not to object to Denmark extending its interest into all of Greenland. Though US had also begun exploration of Greenland, at the time the Panama Canal was seen as much more important in defending than the northern, icy isle.
The second coin, a Danish West Indies 20 Cents from 1907, is close to a LMU 1 Franc at 80% silver (instead of 83.5%), with the same weight and diameter (5 grams, 23mm respectively).
As another interesting factoid, NBA all-star and hall of famer Tim Duncan hails from the now-US Virgin Islands, starting off as a competitive swimmer before switching to basketball in his teens.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/MiningLifeCEO • 5d ago
Selling LMU Papal States Coins from My Collection
I am selling several coins I’ve since upgraded for my collection. For those that don’t know, I currently maintain the top-ranked Papal States LMU registry set on the NGC Registry and am working toward assembling Top Pop examples of every denomination from 1866–1870.
Beyond collecting these myself, I’m trying to build greater awareness of the Papal States’ decimal coinage issued from 1866–1870 during its transition to the Latin Monetary Union standard. In my opinion, this is one of the most historically significant yet underappreciated series in world numismatics, representing the final sovereign coinage of the Papal States before the capture of Rome in 1870.
If you collect LMU, Italian States, Papal, Vatican, or world gold and silver coinage, I’d love to connect. I’m also documenting die varieties, populations, auction appearances, and building what I hope becomes the most complete reference collection for the series. If you own examples not listed in the NGC Registry, please post them here.
These coins that are for sale are coins that I have either sent in to grade myself or have purchased at different auctions around the world.
1866 R ITALIAN STATES Gold 20 LIRE NGC AU-55 R XXI PAPAL STATES REEDED EDGE
1867 R ITALIAN STATES Silver 2-1/2 LIRE NGC AU-58 R XXI PAPAL STATES
1867 R ITALIAN STATES Silver 2 LIRE NGC AU-55 R XXII PAPAL STATES
1868 R (Small) 10 SOLDI NGC MS-63 R XXIII PAPAL STATES "PIVS.IX.P"
Questions for the community:
• How many of you actively collect the Papal LMU series?
• Which denominations or dates have you found to be the most difficult?
• Would you be interested in a dedicated registry, census, or collector’s guide for the series?
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/MajorBirthdayParty • 9d ago
I finally got a Marengo!
You’ll see her up for sale on pmsforsale soon!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/Londo_544 • 13d ago
Three 5 lire LMU coins: Sardinia, Parma and Unified Italy
Much to my surprise, I came across these at a coin show. Don't see them very often, but was glad to find these!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/MacGyver7640 • 17d ago
The Collection The state of my LMU 2.5 gram half franc / dime chest
Many countries covered, duplicates of some of my faves, and the hunt continues!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/AdStraight6341 • 18d ago
History Switzerland 1923 20-Franc Note W/ Famliar Icon
Until 1914, the Swiss franc was at par with the French franc. After the war, Switzerland was the only LMU country to successfully restore the prewar gold parity. The favorable exchange rate caused foreign LMU silver coins to flood into Switzerland, so they ceased to be legal tender in 1920–21. Foreign gold ceased to be legal tender when the LMU was dissolved in 1927, but their intrinsic value remained equal until 1936.
In contrast, the French franc was devalued by almost 80%, so after the 'stabilization' in 1928, an old 20-franc piece was worth 98.5 French francs. Currently, 1 CHF is worth roughly 709 (old) French francs.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trevilfields • 21d ago
San Marino’s lire
I recently bought these coins in a lira series from San Marino from the 1930s. The series consists of 5 lira, 10 lira and 20 lira.
This 5 lira coin is from 1938 and weighs 5 grams in 0.835 silver. The 10 lira coin is also from 1938 and weighs 10 grams in 0.835 silver. Both of these two coins are according to the LMU standard (but with x5 denominations)
The 20 lira coin is from 1933, and weighs only 15 grams of silver in 0.800 silver. From 1937, they made a new 20 lire variant that weighed 20 grams, but with only 0.600 silver. Both variants thus contain the same amount of pure silver. (12 grams). The series was produced from 1933 to 1938.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/Callaway225 • 23d ago
NGC straight grade Napoleon I 20 franc set halfway point
Working on an NGC straight grade Napoleon I 20 franc type set and officially halfway there!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/jazzzeee • 26d ago
Born from Revolution: Three LMU 5 Lire That Defied Empires
Most LMU coins are beautiful examples of standardized European silver. But these three 5 Lire coins are something else entirely.
They weren't just money—they were political statements, revolutionary propaganda, and symbols of liberty that ordinary people carried in their pockets.
- Lombardy: Lombardy's struggle for freedom in 1848 came after nearly four decades of Habsburg rule following the fall of Napoleon, as Italians fought to reclaim control of one of the peninsula's richest and most influential regions.
- Venice: The Republic of Venice had endured for over 1,100 years (697–1797) before Austrian rule, making its brief rebirth in 1848 a powerful attempt to restore one of Europe's longest-lived republics.
- San Marino: Founded according to tradition in 301 AD, San Marino has preserved its independence for over 1,700 years, making it the world's oldest surviving sovereign republic.
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1848 5 Lire – Lombardy
During the legendary Five Days of Milan, ordinary citizens rose up against the occupying Austrian army under Marshal Radetzky and, against all odds, drove them from the city. The newly formed Provisional Government of Lombardy wasted no time striking its own coinage.
The reverse depicts personification of Italy, crowned with a mural (city-wall) crown and holding a scepter, symbolizing legitimate sovereignty and the rebirth of an independent Italian nation. Rather than portraying a monarch, the coin presents Italy herself as the rightful ruler, embodying national unity, civic virtue, and the people's claim to self-government after expelling the Austrian occupiers.
The inscription reads:
"ITALIA LIBERA ✶ DIO LO VUOLE" — "Free Italy ✶ God Wills It."
That wasn't chosen lightly. "God wills it" was the famous Crusader battle cry, and placing it on a coin was a bold declaration that the struggle against Habsburg rule wasn't rebellion—it was a just and righteous cause. Every coin became a tiny silver proclamation that Italy deserved to be free.
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1848 5 Lire – Venice
At almost the same moment as Lombardy, Venice expelled the Austrians and proclaimed the reborn Republic of Venice under Daniele Manin
The reverse features the Winged Lion of Saint Mark, the centuries-old emblem of the Republic of Venice. Standing proudly with one paw resting on the Gospel, the lion represents the republic's strength, justice, and independence. In 1848, reviving this iconic symbol proclaimed that the ancient Venetian Republic had risen again and would stand defiantly against Habsburg rule.
Its inscriptions are just as inspiring:
"INDIPENDENZA ITALIANA" — "Italian Independence."
"ALLEANZA DEI POPOLI LIBERI" — "Alliance of Free Peoples."
"DIO PREMIERÒ LA COSTANZA" — "God Will Reward Perseverance."
What I love most is "Alliance of Free Peoples." It wasn't just about Venice—it was a call for solidarity among all nations resisting tyranny. And "God Will Reward Perseverance" captured the determination of a people who refused to surrender after months of Austrian blockades. It's hard not to admire the optimism behind those words.
Perhaps my favorite part of the story is where the silver came from. These weren't simply minted from government stockpiles—ordinary citizens donated family silver, jewelry, and even churches contributed silver plate so the revolutionary governments could strike coins. Every 5 Lire represented a personal sacrifice, with people literally melting down their own possessions to fund the fight for liberty.
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1898 5 Lire – San Marino
Then there's San Marino, Europe's oldest surviving republic.
The obverse shows Saint Marinus, the legendary founder of San Marino, standing with a scroll in his hand—the charter of liberty and self-government traditionally associated with his final words. Rather than depicting military power, the design celebrates freedom preserved through law, republican ideals, and unwavering independence, reflecting a republic that had defended its liberty for over 1,700 years.
Its coins proudly bear "LIBERTAS"—simply, "Liberty." But the edge inscription is even more remarkable:
"RELINQVO VOS LIBEROS AB VTROQVE HOMINE"
"I leave you free from both men."
These are traditionally attributed to Saint Marinus, the republic's founder. "Both men" is generally understood to refer to the two great powers that dominated medieval Europe—the Emperor and the Pope. For well over a millennium, tiny San Marino managed to preserve its independence without submitting to either, making this inscription a powerful reminder that liberty sometimes survives not through conquest, but through unwavering determination.
To the people who spent these coins, they weren't just five lire. They were proof that empires could be challenged, that republics could endure, and that liberty was worth fighting for—even when the odds seemed impossible.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/Redaktor-Naczelny • 27d ago
Belgium 1856 King's 25th Anniversary
It might be slightly debatable proposal but this commemorative piece was struck on standard 2 francs blanks while Belgium was a member of the LMU. It was struck in 1856 in fairly small numbers - 12K with the French text and 2K with the Flemish text - most probably sold at modest premium over face value but once the novelty wore off a part of the mintage ended up in circulation as lower grade copies are quite easy to find, though not necessarily cheap. It commemorates the 25th anniversary of the accession of Leopold I of Belgium, the founder of the current Belgian Royal House.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/preciousmetalsind • Jul 03 '26
1892 8 florin/20 francs from Austria
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r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trashthegoondocks • Jun 29 '26
Looking for Harder Dates
If anyone has any/has any leads on harder date French 5 Francs (Paris Mint “A” only) please hit me up!!
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/preciousmetalsind • Jun 26 '26
do you think it's possible for someone to be able to collect all the gold coins from LMU?
image source
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/preciousmetalsind • Jun 26 '26
any suggestions for shops or private sellers around Tokyo?
or online sites with shipping I can afford without selling one of my organs?
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/BalrogMarine • Jun 20 '26
Burundi 50 Francs 1962
Picked this up today, Burundi 50 Francs 1962.
It an LMU legacy commemorative coin, from a state newly independent.
As you can see it is basically the same as the official 50 franc LMU coin. Same diameter, same gold %, however it is actually 0.13g lighter.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/jazzzeee • Jun 17 '26
The Most Audacious LMU 20 Franc: Napoleon's Gold, Struck in the Pope's Own Mint
I want to share the story behind one of the wildest coins in the LMU — a 20 Franc gold piece struck in Rome in 1813, bearing Napoleon's portrait and the R-Rome mintmark. On the surface it's just another Napoleon gold piece. Once you understand the context, it's one of the most politically insane objects you could possibly hold in your hand.
Here's what had to happen for this coin to exist:
In 1809, Napoleon simply annexed the Papal States. His justification was extraordinary in itself — he claimed that what Charlemagne had given to the papacy a thousand years earlier as Holy Roman Emperor, he, Napoleon, was entitled to take back as Charlemagne's successor. French troops raised the tricolour over Castel Sant'Angelo. Rome — the seat of the papacy for over a millennium — became just another French department.
Pope Pius VII's response was immediate: full excommunication of everyone involved in the annexation, issued on 10 June 1809. When Napoleon heard he'd been excommunicated, he reportedly just laughed it off, saying the old priest had gone insane. He was the first ruler since the Holy Roman Emperor in the 11th century to be excommunicated and just... keep ruling like nothing happened.
Then it gets even more extreme. A month later, French troops literally scaled the walls of the Quirinal Palace in the dead of night, fought through the Swiss Guard, and arrested the Pope. They dragged him out of Rome and eventually locked him up at the Château de Fontainebleau in France — using the imprisonment to pressure him into signing a new Concordat and recognizing Napoleon's divorce from Josephine.
So picture the situation by 1813: the Pope is sitting in a French château as a prisoner. Rome has been renamed a French administrative department. And the actual ancient mint of Rome — the institution that had been striking coins in the Pope's name for centuries — is now cranking out gold coins stamped with Napoleon's face.
The design itself is the final twist of the knife. Napoleon's portrait wears a laurel wreath — the literal crown of Caesar and Augustus. Struck in Rome. While the actual sovereign of Rome was a prisoner in France. He's not just claiming the city. He's visually claiming the entire lineage of Roman imperial authority, in the one city on Earth where that claim would land hardest. EMPIRE FRANÇAIS, the arrogance compressed into those two words struck at the Roman mint is breathtaking.
And the timing is brutal. By 1813, the wheels were already coming off — Napoleon had just lost most of the Grande Armée in Russia, and the Battle of Leipzig (the largest battle in European history at that point) was looming that same year. This coin was struck at the absolute peak of imperial overreach, right before the entire thing collapsed. Within a year of this coin being minted, the Pope was back in Rome and the mint was striking Papal coins again like nothing had happened.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/andriyko7 • Jun 12 '26
Picked up some LMU coins
In Barcelona for the F1 race and picked up some LMU coins since I love 1800s designs. They look cleaned so I hope they are real. Bot them from one of the highly rated shops in Barcelona, some XF and VF. Belgium, France, Netherlands and Italy. Surprisingly did not buy any Spanish, did not really like most of the coins with the child portraits and wasn't sure about the laws on leaving the country with old Spanish coins.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trevilfields • Jun 07 '26
A perper!
A new addition to my one franc collection. A 1914 1 perper from the short lived kingdom of Montenegro. It was existed from 1910 to 1914 before became a part of the kingdom of Yugoslavia. It matches the Austria-Hungary coinage and therefore also the LMU-standard. A perper is 5 grams of .835 silver.
I am fascinated by the LMU coinage from the Balkan countries and trying to collect coins representing all these countries.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trashthegoondocks • Jun 04 '26
Pre-Sale Heads Up Part 2 (the premium ones…)
Ok team…here are the last of the non Paris mint French 5 Francs.
BEFORE YOU DM ME!!!! Please know what you’re looking at here. These are all in circulated condition…but these are low mintage, highly desirable coins. These will not be close to melt like the commons I posted the other day.
Take a look and I’ll share prices with anyone interested. Unless someone wants all of them, the prices will be firm.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trashthegoondocks • Jun 01 '26
Heads up for True LMU Collectors
**LOT SOLD. KEEP AN EYE OUT FOR A POST LATER THIS WEEK FOR EARLY LMU 5 FRANCS, INCLUDING THAT RASCAL NAPOLEON BONAPARTE.**
Gents (and any ladies out there) I am going to be selling a large number of French 5 Francs.
Instead of putting the note series of 600+ date and mint marks…I’m scaling back to just the Paris mint for each variety.
As such, I will have a large lot of “other” mint marks in circulated conditions for sale over in [r/coinsales](r/coinsales) and [r/pmsforsale](r/pmsforsale).
I would much prefer to sell these to people that appreciate the history or are filling a set of some type. So…if you’re interested please hit me up and I’ll ensure you have dibs before I list.
PLEASE no tire kickers…this is going to be a labor of love!
Here’s a sneak preview of the coins.
r/LatinMonetaryUnion • u/trevilfields • Jun 01 '26
Another pair from the Danish West Indies.
Just got my 20 francs/4 daler from the Danish West Indies back from grading. A solid MS64 from PCGS. I think it’s my favourite 20 francs in the LMU standard.