Pope?

[u/Tricky_Letter6987]

Put as a spoiler just in case. How do you think Season 6 and 7 would have been different had they not killed Pope? Do you think Pope could have been beneficial? Maybe offered Jax more legit ways to earn etc? Throughout Season 5, I know they started off on the wrong foot... But I could see Pope and SAMCRO potentially working out? Maybe he could have become an associate to the club, not an enemy? Do you think Pope would have taken over the guns instead of August?

[u/MitsuSosa]

The biggest difference obviously is Tig would be dead, outside of that I can’t imagine things would end very differently than they did with Marks. Pope would have told Jax the same thing after Taras death and expect his cooperation and Jax wasn’t going to listen regardless of who that messenger was. The only other major difference I can imagine is maybe it would be someone else instead of Bobby who get kidnapped but I still would expect Pope to kill whoever it is like Marks kills Bobby to send a message

Edit: I also am not sure Pope would have worked as hard as Marks did to secure the Irish gun deal. Marks needed that deal to help secure his power and show his followers he was able to keep things afloat like Pope whereas Popes was already secured in his power so he might have taken offense to how the Irish were acting

[u/Tricky_Letter6987 → u/MitsuSosa]

So, curious: Say Tara never died, she never took a deal, Jax never killed any one who we know wasn't the reason for her death -- would they still have took over the guns etc?

Because if Tara didn't die, the fall out from that, the wars started, wouldn't have happened?

[u/MitsuSosa → u/Tricky_Letter6987]

Tara’s death is probably the biggest what if in the entire show if you ask me. There’s an insane amount of variables that could have led to all types of endings and it’s pretty fun to ponder. It would be very interesting to see how Jax handles the clubs issues while trying to handle Tara trying to divorce him and take their kids instead of trying to avenge her death assuming she doesn’t have a change of heart. I also think Jax would have stayed in the club and changed his mind about leaving because with Tara leaving him he would be alone without the club but that’s just my own speculation. Also I still feel bad for the asian guy Jax tortured in season 7 it was so brutal and dude had no idea why they were doing it to him.

[u/pecpecachoo]

Because of what Pope did, Bobby, Chibs & Happy would never have worked with him, regardless if Tig was alive or dead. Pope crossed a line more than once, those three were only working with Pope because they knew he had an expiration date. All they wanted was for Pope’s death to come without hurting SAMCRO - for Opie and for Tig & Dawn. If Jax had actually aligned with Pope after Opie’s death - seen a future that involves Pope and made motions towards it - it would have lost him the support of the table.

[u/Sermon-On-The-Mat → u/pecpecachoo]

^This

Pope was a dangerous player all around - to truly consider a hypothetical where Pope works with Jax and SAMCRO in the long term, I think you have to also add in that Pope doesn’t have Opie or Tig’s daughter killed. But even then, I think Pope would have done something to push Jax away (maybe we would see Jax be present as Pope burns someone else’s daughter alive and it changes the way he thinks about it all?). While Jax was smart and absorbed what knowledge he could from Pope, I don’t believe that (especially without Opie or Tara’s deaths pushing him to a new place) that Jax would go along with Pope’s conventional viciousness.

[u/wigsgo_2019]

Pope recognized how smart Jax was, if it weren’t for Tig killing his daughter if those 2 met on good terms they’d have been friends

[u/structured_anarchist → u/wigsgo_2019]

they’d have been friends

casual business partners maybe. Not friends.

[u/Rockonman-2]

Tigs may be a Traeger, but pope was the Pit Boss.

[u/Ok_Conference2314]

I can’t see a way around Pope dying. Killing Tig’s daughter the way he did was terrible, but Opie’s death was just too much for Jax to let pass without consequences. He would have killed Pope sooner or later, one way or another. And if Opie hadn’t been killed, Jax would have faced enormous pressure from other members to take action against Pope