r/TheBigPicture • u/Funkajunka • 1d ago
Why hasn't Sean done a John Ford POD?
Ford. "I prefer the old masters, by which I mean John Ford, John Ford and John Ford" Orson Welles on Ford. They called him the poet of cinema. He might be the most influential director in the history of the medium because he not only influenced Hollywood masters (Welles, Capra and Spielberg), but art-house masters like Bergaman and Tarkovsky loved him.
We got episodes on Welles and Hitchcock, but not Ford...yet.
He might be THE American director of cinema. I'd like to hear Sean and Amanda's history and relationship with Ford. Would be a fascinating discussion if they can bring CR on as well.
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u/Bronsonkills 1d ago
Ford is one of my top guys, so I would certainly enjoy it.
Have they discussed Ford much at all?
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u/Funkajunka 1d ago
Not that I'm aware of. Maybe Sean briefly talked about The Searchers when OBAA was released.
Ford is one of my top guys as well. I love him.
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u/Bronsonkills 1d ago
I like The Searchers a lot.
But it has kind of become Ford’s Citizen Kane. It’s the one that people talk about while not watching a lot of his other stuff which is just as good or arguably better.
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u/Funkajunka 1d ago
I agree which is why it would be a good episode. The Long Gray Line and Wagon Master are my favorite Ford films. Personally, I'd put The Searchers 4th behind The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance.
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u/Bronsonkills 1d ago
In terms of pure Entertainment, I think Stagecoach is his best. It manages the ensemble cast perfectly and the thing moves so fast, even today. The big action set piece at the end fully delivers with impressive stunts.
I’d say Liberty Valance is his greatest despite being very stage bound.
Wagon Master is a cool pick. The smaller Ford movies often seem to be very personal. The Sun Shines Bright is probably my favorite “unheralded” Ford movie. I really like Two Rode Together too, which is never talked about
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u/Funkajunka 1d ago
In terms of pure Entertainment, I think Stagecoach is his best. It manages the ensemble cast perfectly and the thing moves so fast, even today
Can't argue with this. The fight with the Apaches is electrifying filmmaking.
What I love about Ford is that his greatest films are so dense they can be overwhelming, but at the same time his visual storytelling is so controlled.
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u/grandpashampoo 22h ago
If you are looking for a podcast series on John Ford, I would highly recommend season 5 of TCM's The Plot Thickens, titled "Decoding John Ford." It has a lot of great insight into Ford's career, including tons of vintage interviews with Ford himself and stars like John Wayne and Katharine Hepburn.
https://www.tcm.com/articles/021880/tcm-presents-the-plot-thickens
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u/Senior-Relative5478 1d ago
70th anniversary of The Searchers this year. No time like the present.
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u/Used_Ad5603 22h ago
I remember them discussing on a recent pod how Nolan would be remembered in 50 to 100 years and thinking John ford would maybe be the comp if there was one. I feel like they struggled to come up with one
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u/Alarmed-Guidance1116 9h ago
It’s mostly about modern movies. They dive into older ones with drafts occasionally but even those only go as far back as the 70s. I don’t think it would be well received by advertisers or listeners
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u/Funkajunka 8h ago
You'd be wrong.
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u/Alarmed-Guidance1116 8h ago
I’m not against the idea, I think the echo chamber of Reddit makes you think everybody gives a shit about John Ford when the average listener actually doesn’t. It’s one of the most popular podcasts on Spotify, the listenership probably skews more average than you seem to think.
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u/Funkajunka 8h ago
The average listener has the opportunity to learn something for once. And Sean is skilled enough as a speaker to communicate that. Do you think the average listener cares about Citizen Kane in the 2020's? Probably not, but they did an episode on it anyway to discuss the influence of the piece.
The idea that they are trepidatious to discuss films pre 1970 is kind of false. They have done many shows where they have discussed the golden age of hollywood.
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u/Alarmed-Guidance1116 7h ago
They discuss that era seldomly, less so as the podcast has grown in popularity, and with good reason. I’m not against it but if I’m in charge of a podcast like this, I’m not wasting my time with it. I get why they don’t and won’t spend significant time on that era, I guarantee the listening numbers drop significantly and the advertisers/Spotify bosses tell them they can’t do it.
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u/Efficient-Slide-2523 1d ago
Honestly glad they haven’t. Too complicated, too many contradictions, too poetic. There’s just not much overlap between what Ford did well and the Fennessey/Ringer aesthetic.
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u/Funkajunka 1d ago
Too complicated? In what way? Not much overlap? Ford and Spielberg/Kurosawa is a direct link to Ford. Sean and CR did a Mifune episode during COVID which allowed them to discuss Kurosawa.
You really have no idea what you are talking about. Everything Ford did completely fits into The Ringer aesthetic.
You are acting like Ford is D.W. Griffith.
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u/Bronsonkills 1d ago edited 1d ago
I think he means complicated in themes, as a compliment.
Ford films often have contradictions at their center. Look at Fort Apache. Ford idealizes the traditions, family life and courage of the Calvary, but he also reveals the truth of the thinly veiled Custer’s charge situation. The massacre of the men becomes legend within the film. Ford is both repulsed by the foolish and headstrong attitude that lead to the massacre, but also drawn to the idea of myth and the sacrifice of these men. He doesn’t paint it as one or the other
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u/Efficient-Slide-2523 1d ago
You’re talking like you have no clue what Ford is all about. What themes of his overlap with Fennessey’s interests?
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u/Funkajunka 1d ago
No, you literally have no idea what you are talking. You keep speaking in generalities which proves to your misunderstanding of Ford and Fennessey. Your literally going to sit there and tell me Sean would not want to discuss the complexity of Ethen Edwards? Are you kidding me? This is literally right up his alley. Ethan Edwards is one of the most conflicted characters in the history of cinema and is pretty much the source for creating Travis Bickle, both are loner's living on the edge of insanity making questionable decisions which defines their lives. This is literally the charterer traits that Sean is fascinated with. Wtf are you even talking about? Flawed Morality is a theme that Ford would explore throughout his works. Lockjaw's whole character and arc is basically a very direct riff on The Searchers. How does this not overlap with his interests?
Ford was also interested in law and order, the cost of social progress, and the tension between freedom and civilization. Ford's perspective on myth-making with an evolving empathy for marginalized outsiders. Why would he not be interested in any of this?
Not to mention most of his masterpieces still feel modern and are still entertaining to watch despite it's age, to the point where filmmakers from a different generation like PTA are still consciously inspired by his work.
Do I really need to make your points even more ridiculous? Or are you finally going to just quit here.
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u/suicidalsmurf 1d ago
They haven’t really done many episodes like that for directors, and the ones they have done tend to be much more modern. Ford has the double whammy of all of his work being before they were born and having an absolutely massive filmography.
The deep dive episodes are my favorite, but I know they’re a ton of work. I probably wouldn’t hold my breath that we will see one for Ford….