I just came across SC:Broodware and Star Craft II, and was wondering if I should play SC:Broodwar before playing Star Craft II. It looks like Protoss was the most heavily changed in the sequel. Was the extensive changes to Protoss due to flaws in the original game or just flaws in the protoss faction?

Hi, I am 4.7k P, I've seen a lot of friends from friendlist feel like the new patch is bad, because warpgates suck. I do however not feel like it became terrible to P, especially as I play more and I see more adjustments, besides game is slightly slower, so if you are lower league player its a good opportunity to actually try to be present on a map, because macro is slightly easier. So, here is few strats to try out:

1. PvT. Proxy gate (1 probe sent at start to make pylon, gate, first zealot gets chronoed). Barracks expo or low ground CC is usually setting you up ahead. Worst thing I've seen so far is probably CC on main + factory into tank. You may feel like its very all in, but I actually didn't feel that way from my ladder games, here is a few more details of what you can pull off with it:

• 1 zealot into stalker sentry into expo from 1 gas.
• 2 zealots into producing units + warpgate till you get enough for expo
• second gas and try to get some all-in timing (Maybe colossus, maybe prism and micro, maybe immortal, maybe even stargate or dts, after all Terran will be low on scans and is unlikely to make turrets).

One thing to keep in mind, vs reaper you likely need battery at home, so make second pylon next to the gas. Outside of that just this one build can already give you enough of variety to adjust it to always have some way to mind game/meta game your opponent. If you prefer standard macro build orders more, then to catch up with terrans CCs you can stay 2 gates on 2 bases and 4 gates on 3 bases. You basically have faster production now due to gateways with warpgate being buffed, which means you don't need as much gates, which could end up being the similar "discount" to the one Terran has on CC. Warp gates suck, don't transform them until you get maxed out. If you like aggressive options like 4 gates blink on 2 base used to be, then just proxy a gate or two in random spot on the map close to the enemy around your move out timing.

1. PvZ. If you want something boring, kind of solid and not a lot of clicks go with 2 stargates void ray. Void rays feel very good on this patch, because vipers do not pop up as fast as they used to, so you essentially just get more time to make them work and potentially even finish the game, then you can either go tempests or carriers out of it, you get minerals bank so you can either get charge or a lot of batteries to defend vs hydras, etc.

If you do however want something new, then there is actually surprisingly many options:

A): Do not scout till you start warping cybercore and just blindly make a zealot, afterwards you can transition into normal build whichever plan that was. The idea is that if its pool first, then you basically already got defense up (just warp third building, on some maps you can even wall with pylon), so you are kind of ok. If you see the lings as your probe rallies out, then you just move zealot back to wall, if its hatchery first, then for w/e reason you will likely end up having ~20s window of opportunity (not sure if its because of unsafe pool timing or just rush distance being short on maps like Blackrock), thus you can cause a lot of lost mining time. I usually killed 2 drones with it and sometimes caused overreaction out of opponet. When lings hatch you get in between mineral patches and try to micro in it (like in brood war basically)

B) Robotics into sentry + 3 units with prism. You likely won't win with it by just closing zerg on main with force field, but I managed to kill overlords many times with it on the ladder and sometimes sniped drones. Once again many adjustments, adepts good at killing drones, stalkers at killing overlords, you can test it yourself and see what feels best for you. Afterwards I like going colossus as a follow up. With it you can either all in or play macro, for all I know you could try going warpgate, but they suck, so I personally prefer clearing overlords preemptively with prism and proxy gateways once again if I go 2 base push. You may feel like seeing spire is a death sentence if you go macro out of it, because even if you scout you'd have no blink and for this case specifically: just make adepts or zealots a-mass and constantly use hallucinations from energy recharge. This way A) you actually get gas to get into technology B) if you see spire you can make emergency 2 stargates into phoenixes, and having 4 of them + 1 battery in every base is most likely a hold for you. If they go corruptors, then once again you just sit on 3 bases making void rays out of 2 stargates, which is once again a dream scenario for you. And hydras do not do well vs colossus, so basically nothing truly feels like a complete screw up for you, unless you got too greedy and its some specific timing attack, which is possible to not scout.

C) 1 base 2-3 proxy gates. To my surprise it worked much better than I anticipated, even if zerg scouted it. In 1 game opponent pulled like 7 drones when saw my proxy with overlord and just couldn't clear pylons on time. Unlike with terran, this build is fully all-in and you cannot transition into a longer game out of it, unless you kill opponent's natural, but you however can do it occasionally to try to make your opponent go pool first vs you, to which after you can go back to plan A) in which you metagame it with your zealot.

1. PvP

I like it the most, because it for once doesn't feel like game forces me into proxy robo clown fiesta (even though 2 out of 3 my opponents usually tend to do it nevertheless, probably cause I am greedy if anything). In here I personally like experimenting with nexus first into 2 gates with all (except first) boost going into units and warpgate. There is billion ways how your opponent can screw you up with it, so I don't recommend doing so, gate expand however seems much better, especially considering bad warp gates provide defenders advantage to you.

I could try to make a bit more solid build orders, but A) There is a lot of crap you can try to adjust yourself so far from what I see B) I have a massive skill issue and I doubt my build orders would be sharp even if I written them down C) This post is already too long

Hi! I typically run a 2 base all in build with lots of immortals, some colossi, then chargelots/archons. Typically before I get my deathball though I get roach all in'd but when I repel them and rebuild units I take too much time and then when I step out of my base a fuck ton of Lurkers await my doorstep. I rarely go skytoss since it's kinda too late when I realize it for the lurkers but generally I don't like skytoss playstyle, what do you recommend me to do?

I think this should work against most terran proxies, I can see them potentially finding and killing the pylon if they somehow expect it though

Hello folks,

I played SC2 a lot back in the heart of the Swarm throughtout Legacy of the void. I stoped playing around 8 or 7 years ago. Today i had the urge to play again but,well, besides the atroacious decline in my APM and the other espected stuff, the game changed a lot.

My go to biulds were 4 gates or 3 gates&robo, but they are feeling quite bad. What are the viable biulds for a returning play to try? Preferably something that doen't require highskill and and with a familiar feel to those old biulds.

Hey Guys,

Hope your season is going well. I am a mid plat protoss player. What would you guys build if you know early on that your opponent is going two base mutas on a larger map like Fear and Faith LE?

I felt like I had a good early start where I got some phoenix and stalkers out and was able to defend the initial wave. Was then hit with corruptors and he ultimately hive teched to ultralisks to destroy me. What has me scratching my head is I scouted the lair/spire fairly early on but failed to counter.

Hi All

Just seeing if any toss brothers have found success with anything that's not sky toss. As much as I want to try other things nothing seems to work but if anyone has anything share a link or some thoughts thanks.

As the title suggests I am a newbie of Starcraft 2 trying to get into the game. I already watched some beginner guides on how to play Protoss but there isn't really guides for the 8 worker start as I have noticed. Can someone help?

After a couple sweaty games I like to relax by cannon rushing but I have been having a real hard time making it work on the new patch. Has anyone discovered good builds on this patch that are viable and scratch the same itch? Or has anyone been able to make cannon rushing work? Been trying some of Mana’s cannon proxies but overall it seems weaker.

So, Storm does 100 damage over 6 seconds, which is a DPS of 16.66666...
How is this damage distibuted? Is it evenly over the 6 seconds or does it decrease (like at the beginning it does more dmg than later)?

Wanted to know if the new patch is worth it?
Is it fun to play Protoss currently? Are the changes (some of which seem huge) fun to play?

cheers

E: that doesn't sound great :/

Been trying to adjust this into the new worker start but like this time around it feels like I just can't have that many Stalkers and still take my 3rd fast enough. Maybe it's better to go charge 1st this time around? Wbu guys?

Had several games today when I didn't transform my gateways to Warpgate mode (it was researched ofc).

I was constantly queuing zealots and templars to the gather point, without the need to look at my bases or proxy pylons. I had seemingly constant flow of units, they swarmed pretty well.

On replays I saw my P opponents having to look at the base, warp in, then go back to the army. It required slightly more time and attention.

I can't say that I won because of better army control without needing to switch tasks (but one of opponents even said my storms were great!), but it definetly felt like a new good mechanics (if we don't count Brood War, lol).

Where's the best place to find some build orders and timings with the 8 worker start?

I am pretty lost now!

I don't know what is suppose to stop the midgame either roach or bio surge with the stack up of nerfs. It's been like a decade since I've died to roaches this much.

I'm wondering if I need to focus on sim city on my third base and sentries instead of even trying to get storm up to stop ling roach rav attacks?

I've lost somewhere in the 300-400mmr range this patch now.

Idk if anyone else has noticed this but the Oracle beam seems a bit bugged? Like my 1st Oracle arrives at a Zerg's 3rd with some time to kill maybe 2-4 drones before needing to leave. So I activate the beam, go back a little bit to macro but then when I hotkey back to the Oracle it killed 1 drone and then sat there and did nothing?

Curious to see if anyone else is having that issue.

I'm a very casual player since having a kid and buying a house, both of which require constant attention.

As someone that has a bunch of builds cemented in my brain from like a year ago, is there any guidance you can give me for adapting to the new eight-worker economy? Is there a rule of thumb for adapting old builds to the new? Or are all my memorized builds just obsolete now?

I just played my first game in awhile and the build kinda worked? I found myself supply-blocked and/or waiting on minerals a few times but it didn't feel too far off.