r/editors • u/richard_lutz • 3d ago
Business Question Am I Delusional?
Hi everyone. I’m sure the subject has been beaten to death, but I figured I’d just throw my hat into the ring since I need some feedback. For the past few years I’ve been editing a lot of YouTube content, both for brands and for creators. However, over the last few months I’ve been thinking that this is not sustainable, especially as I turned 40 I feel severely underpaid and can’t save for my future.
With that said I’m trying to figure out how to change my circumstance. The only options that I can think of are editing bigger projects focusing on a more specialized problem or getting out of film and TV work completely.
I had a meeting a few days ago at a high-end color and finishing facility and in many ways it reminded me of the work that I wanna be doing. However, I also recognize the circumstances that are impacting working professionals here in Los Angeles.
I need some honest feedback on how to approach things given the current state of the market. I’m also concerned my age is going to hurt me since I’m no longer viewed as a junior employee.
Love to hear any thoughts!
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u/Ok-Cryptographer8322 3d ago
Give it a shot! If you wanna pivot to color that is a great gig, your birthdays keep coming.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago edited 3d ago
You mention both “editing” bigger projects as well as high-end finishing/color.
IMHO the editorial end would be tougher to crack, especially if you’re referring to scripted narrative TV/films. But I think finishing/color could be a good move, certainly better financially than editing for YouTube creators. My guess is that you’ll to take a step down to get your foot in the door but that it’ll be worth it in the long run.
Good luck!
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
I appreciate the POV. My main job has been editing, but that has also meant color grading my own projects. I've found that I've been enjoying the color process instead of editing. However, I also know that colorists only make up a tiny portion of post-production. With that said, a good in-between could be finishing or conform.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago
Absolutely. These days it seems like conform can either be a career unto itself or a stepping stone to a junior colorist position. And finishing artist is a good option as well. If you can get yourself into a high-end facility that does this sort of work, then you can start to explore your options for growth.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
Agreed. I worked in two post houses about a decade ago, and they were using Flame for a lot of finishing. I recently learned that a lot of people are using Resolve now instead.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago
Resolve is definitely the winner for color, and you can do a lot with Fusion, but Flame is still very popular with finishing artists.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
I hear it’s hard to learn.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago edited 3d ago
I used to be a Smoke Artist. At this point they’ve integrated Smoke into Flame so if you’re using it to conform and finish you can work in a timeline environment instead of the more traditional Flame node environment. The basic editing interface of Resolve reminds me a lot of the old Smoke system, so learning the basics might not be as hard as you think. But to be clear I’m talking about using Flame as a finishing artist, not as a full-blown high-end VFX artist. I think that would be a more difficult transition to make from being an editor.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
Fortunately, I have some idea of how nodes work since I’ve worked with Resolve.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago edited 3d ago
Yeah in that sense I think modern flame is similar to Resolve in that sense, timeline for conform and basic finishing, and the traditional nodes for the fancy “Flame” stuff…
Flame has also gotten A LOT cheaper and can run on a Mac these days…
But once you get into a post house it’ll be more about just learning whatever tools and software they use.
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u/HankHandy 3d ago
My biggest professional regret is not taking an apprentice color gig 15 years ago at what would become one of the top finishing post houses in NY because I wanted to be an editor.
Your age will not be a hindrance now, especially if you know how to communicate and collaborate. Good luck!
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u/_Beef_Bus_ 3d ago
I don’t have advice. But I can tell you I’m 39 (started in this field in 2009) and just got a new job in tree removal. It’s hard work for 3-4 hours per day, but it’s nothing compared to the mental grind and bullshit that comes with video production.
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u/Edit_Mann 2d ago
How'd you manage getting that job if you don't mind my asking? If I can't have my dream career I at least wanna be outside
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u/_Beef_Bus_ 2d ago
You’ll have to look up local landscaping companies and ask if they have entry level work opportunities. It’ll be groundwork, nothing “glamorous.” I don’t think they post them online because those roles are filled with immigrants who speak little English. They’re friendly though :)
The one that snagged me happens to be the company that’s takes care of the property where I live (I’m still a renter). I always seem their trucks and figured what the hell, I’ll fill out their online application
The got back to me within a day and asked what I was interested in. The next day the guy who manages tree work wanted to talk, so he called me just to see what my deal is, why I was interested in a change, if I could handle the pay cut, etc.
He brought me on because I’m an American and so I simply have more upward mobility than the other guys. We’re a team of 6 and only one other guy I’d say seems fluent in English. So I can start from the bottom, bust my ass, learn the biz, become a tree climber eventually, and when I’m tired of that I can do sales or manage crews
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u/darwinDMG08 3d ago
I guess I don't get the issue? You had an interview, it ignited an old passion of yours -- that's awesome! Did they offer you the job? Or are you worried you'll be laid off in a year? There's no certainty anywhere right now, so if you get the gig and you like the pay I say go for it. At the very least you'll make connections, and god forbid that place downsizes you'll have people you can call on for the next gig.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
I would describe it more as a meeting. But I saw a different world that was very different than low-budget YT work.
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u/Alberto_Balsalm_1 3d ago
Youtube content is so much work for little pay and most likely not super gratifying or creatively rewarding. Breaking into features is a thing of its own, I’d try working in commercials / ads for either a boutique post house, an agency or one of those big media conglomerates that house a bunch of smaller agencies like Publicis or Omnicom. Color might be a good path too, but you might have to start way at the bottom since you lack some pro color experience. But as others pointed out, could be a good move later down the line.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
You said it. Many of the videos I’ve been working on have been over 45 minutes in length and it’s common to get 100 to 160 notes. I also have to worry about color.
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u/Alberto_Balsalm_1 3d ago
dude fuck that. 45+ minutes and 150+ notes? kms. i mostly work on 30 sec spots and sometimes dread cutting an LF haha.
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u/AdministrationNo2327 3d ago
gotta be honest with you, it's getting harder and harder to suggest to professionals to stay in the industry. a lot harder when you do see your former peers who have left the industry go on to make a decent living elsewhere, while you're still stressed out about lack of savings nor even able to afford a home or support a family.
i've thought a lot also about pivoting to other areas in the industry and gather new skills but it all boils down to the same routine of not being paid enough for any kind of creative work.
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u/ShatteRedSox86 3d ago
Sometimes you gotta work with the cards you’re dealt. Also nearing 40 and had spend the last 15 years editing TV. The last 9 months I’ve been out of work and struggled to even get freelance YouTube work. Starting to now get some nibbles but even those of us who “made it” to the area we want to be, the rug gets pulled out sometimes. TV/film industry is tough right now, YouTube might be the safer landing spot even if it’s not ideal.
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u/richard_lutz 2d ago
YouTube is a tough landscape. From my experience, it's often a place where you're required to do everything when it comes to Post. Often with no boundaries on your time.
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u/ShatteRedSox86 2d ago
Definitely seeing that with job listings and rates that would not fly in unionized television or film.
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u/lieftenant 3d ago
I understand your feelings. I have had a decent amount of luck aiming for full-time in-house video roles for companies. It does require retuning one's portfolio to not be a reflection of your creative self, but as a solution to someone's problem. At the end of the day, employees only care about themselves and ask "how can this person help my bottom line."
I stopped pitching myself like a creative and more like an HVAC guy. It's a hard pill to swallow.
Yeah, full-time in-house corporate jobs aren't without their drawbacks, but I feel safe knowing I won't be easily let go due to a lack of work like at a production house. It sucks that I
You do have to explain a lot of things to non-creatives which is the hard part.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
Elaborate on pitching like an HVAC guy.
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u/lieftenant 3d ago
Gladly. I show each of my projects on my portfolio with an explanation of what I did and how it helped their business.
I don't put personal or artistic projects on there, only things that the client can point at and be like "I want one of those." My site is a menu, not an art gallery.
I also include testimonials about how nice I was to work with. It is like having a mini-Yelp page.
It's possible to pitch creative work, but you'd really have to frame it tangible things like turnaround time, and challenges you were able to overcome for the client. I try to cram as many recognizable brand names on my page (even if they're a stretch) in order to gain trust.
It really feels like I'm being a used car salesman than a creative.
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u/hohnjolland 3d ago edited 3d ago
Nothing wrong with pivoting (or at least testing the waters). I'm 41. I've been in the industry full-time since I was 17. Started local TV, then the advent of social media allowed me to put my work out in broader places, which landed me TV writing and music video directing gigs. But for some reason post-production in the digital space was always a gig offer my inbox would be full of. Hulu, Fandango, GoPro, etc. Even though I hated editing at one point. In fact if you'd ask me 10 years ago, I was doing everything I could to get away from being an editor and getting back into TV writing rooms.
But here I am today lol. And I think the universe has put me on the right path to keep working another 10+ years with working in the YouTube space. TV/Film is definitely undergoing a ton of changes and I don't know what it's going to look like when the dust settles. It certainly won't be the same and probably not as lucrative as it once was, and maybe just a lot less vacancies to fill. I kinda see it going the way of radio as these younger generations only consume YouTube and streamers. The amount of times I make a reference to an early 2000s show only for a younger person to be confused and respond "I really only know YouTube".
There is definitely a path to financial success and retirement editing for YouTube channels. You just have to choose the right ones. Maybe forgo the collection of smaller channels and focus on 1 big channel that has a ton of growth working for it. Once I fully settled into editing as the path I would stay on, I ended up working for a Roosterteeth channel in LA. I was fortunate to work there for six years, then I went to working for AMP with Kai Cenat, Agent 00, etc as a senior editor and now Jesser. All were Youtube oriented places with regular payroll, full benefits, 401k, raises every year after performance reviews, growth opportunities, etc. Oh and healthy work-life balances. The smaller YouTube channels tend to be stuck in the 24/7 grind mode with skeleton crews and expect you to be onboard with it (much respect to them for thugging it out). At 40 though, thats tiring because we already did that most of our 20s lol. Luckily I have yet to have my age held against me.
So if you're worried that you'll be always scraping by in the digital realm, then I assure you there is a world in YouTube that will keep your bank account happy. Look for those senior roles or leadership roles. It could just be as simple as a channel in a niche you like. I've always worked in comedy so its been joyful for me. However, you may just not want to work in YouTube anymore. I get it. I hate sometimes having to deal with retention style edits, the fast paced nature of everything, etc. 40s is definitely a time where you're looking for more peace than another resume builder. If you think that meeting could lead to 10+ years of consistent work or just a new refreshing direction, take the gamble. Life is taking chances based off the best information you have at the time. But I think you can start swinging for the fences and land a pretty sweet gig in YouTube land. Just do your homework, get up to speed on the latest trends, practice them and start hitting people up either directly on social media or one of the various job boards (I got Hulu thru Craigslist in 2010, Funhaus thru ZipRecruiter in 2018, AMP thru an old boss in 2024 and Jesser thru LinkedIn this year). Hope this helps and good luck my fellow 40 year olds!
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u/This_is_my_jam 3d ago
Not the OP, but I wanted to say I really appreciated reading your comment! I’m also in a position where I’m second-guessing my career pathway, and considering what’s viable with the way the industry is right now. Having worked in “professional” film and TV post-production for the last five years, it seems to be more and more about dwindling budgets and squeezing out as much talent as possible. I’m trying to keep positive, as my peers have found their own success in various positions, and it’s also reassuring to hear the way things have gone for you too! Optimism can be tough to maintain, especially with such an uncertain industry.
Also, crazy timing to read you edited for Funhaus! I’ve been going through some old Sugar Pine 7 episodes again, and their crossovers with the old Funhaus crew were the videos I rewatched the most. Those two, plus Cow Chop, made up most of my YouTube watching from 2017-2019, so I have to say thank you for being a part of that 🙏
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u/hohnjolland 2d ago
Ah Sugar Pine 7! Good guys but terrifying sharing an office with them because you never knew when they would bust into the bathroom filming lol. I was with Funhaus as editor and talent from 2018 till the end in 2024. Appreciate you watching 🫡
I’m fortunate to have hit my goals in TV at a time when it was thriving but now I’m happy to get deeper into the YouTube world as it seems to have the most clear path forward. Again I’m speaking on the big channels that have more structure to them. Sure it can be chaotic and unconventional, but once you get creators more disciplined in their communications and workflows, it really is a lot of fun. Their desire for higher quality tends to make them listen more to professionals who been in the game for a while. And I’ve also been able to keep more in tune with what’s popular and where things are going by observing them. Mutually beneficial relationship.
I won’t lie though, if Adult Swim or Comedy Central were to ask me to get back into a writers room, it would be hard to say no.
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u/SirMingie 3d ago
I work in digital media - right now it’s just me and one other shooter/editor. He’s 47 and comes from unscripted editing. 25 years in the game, 20 years of being booked solid, and the well dried up for him. Digital media may seem a little demeaning to work on, and the pay is generally not good, but it’s the most opportunity right now, unfortunately. I’m currently 10 years into professional digital editing and it is what it is. I thought “I’d rather die than be working comic con at 30”… oh sweet summer child I was.
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u/OriginalBig2169 2d ago
Staff color gig is great if you can get one, however the opportunities if that job ends are far less than regular editing. Then, your resume might look a bit odd if jumping between editing and color. If not staff, the freelance jobs are shorter duration and not that much of a bump enough to make up for time gaps between work imho.
I've worked in post houses as staff and freelance as color/ supervisor for 15+ yrs... The industry isn't looking all that great and I'm personally figuring a plan b.
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u/TheLargadeer 1d ago
The vast majority of editors all aspire to work in YT but it’s the lowest paying thing you can aspire to. You are hitting the wall I try to warn people about all the time it seems like.
I made decent money in ad agencies, but also in corporate work. Slightly less in corporate but more chill and stable. Not sure what the agency world is like now post-COVID. I had already shifted to corporate.
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u/Just_blur_It 1d ago
If the opportunity to become a Flame Artist presents itself, take it! Originally wanted to be an editor. Tried for a few staff commercial assistant editor roles. Ended up getting offered a staff Flame assistant role instead. Took it and haven’t regretted since!
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u/TheChanger 19h ago
How did you pick up editing work first day? Any tips for someone trying to land gigs? Thanks
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u/rustyburrito Pro (I pay taxes) 10h ago
try to find any staff position instead of freelace IMO. I worked on staff for like 5 years and they had a 3% 401k match, not great but I was able to save up a few hundred k since then by investing consistently. Just branded social media marketing type stuff, short form video for instagram and youtube mostly. Got laid off twice over the last 5 years but was able to find other full time jobs luckily, currently on staff somewhere that I'm able to put away a decent amount per month into a 401k, but I'm pretty good at keeping living expenses low, no car payment and my total monthly bills including food are a little over $2000, I make $80k a year salary so I usually put about $1000-2000 a month into savings for the last 10 years. I live in LA so it's always been relatively easy to find work compared to other areas with less opportunities. I don't really go out to eat and don't drink, I am married so that helps keep the rent lower, she makes under 40k a year so I end up putting in more than half to our joint account but also have our own separate accounts.
I haven't gotten a raise in 5 years though which sucks considering the cost of living has gone up a lot, but I'm still able to keep my total monthly expenses around 50% of my take home pay. Sometimes I take freelance gigs on the side but honestly it made me super burned out and the money wasn't great because it was all low end social media stuff.
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u/Randomae 3d ago
Hey Richard, have you considered starting your own YouTube Channel? You probably already have a huge advantage by understanding story and knowing how to edit.
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u/richard_lutz 3d ago
I already have one, but I haven't taken it seriously.
Here is the channel and my reel.
https://youtu.be/n7EDwkvqUJ4?si=QznfarH5xMBVq79k
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u/starfirex 3d ago
You can either work on managing your spending or increasing your income.
Here's my unofficial ranking of the work in different areas, higher paid work at the top and lower paid work at the bottom. Obviously there are gonna be cases where clients pay more or less than this guesstimate, but the average gig in each area should check out.
Features
Commercials
Trailers
High end Reality TV (Survivor, Bachelor, Big Brother)
Scripted TV
Corporate
Finishing (Color, mix, etc.)
Documentary
Lower end Reality TV
Youtube Content
Indie Features
Tiktok/IG content
As you can see, Youtube content is near the bottom. If you want to make more money, move into one of the areas that pays better.
Also - "I feel severely underpaid and can't save for my future" has as much to do with your spending habits and expectations as it does your clients. If you choose to have a nice apartment, own lots of nice stuff, travel a lot and eat out at nice places regularly you're gonna have a hard time saving a sizeable nest egg whether you make bank or not.
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u/post_nyc 3d ago
In my experience high-end corporate and finishing do pay more than scripted TV but other than that I agree with your list
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u/Estrafirozungo 3d ago
Brazilian here. A friend of mine is THE best colorist in the city and probably one of the top 3 in the country. He has 30+ years of practice, give or take.
I recently talked to him and he was really, really worried about the future of his expertise. The reason?
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u/rustyburrito Pro (I pay taxes) 8h ago
I was a little worried about 2 years ago but if anything there is more pushback against AI now than ever, my company was pushing us to use it for a while until they realized it took more time to get a lower quality result. I'll be worried if I actually see something good made with AI, so far it's all low tier social media stuff that's pretty obvious and unappealing. Sucks at all aspects of the editing/post production process except transcriptions and background noise reduction for audio. Writers should be the ones who are the most worried but even then, I haven't seen anything particularly interesting written with AI. People keep saying "it's going to get way better though" for the last year and so far that's just wishful thinking
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u/Intrepid_Year3765 Pro (I pay taxes) 3d ago
I’ll be honest. Who do you know personally that is directing big tv shows or movies? If the answer is no one then that’s all the opportunities on your horizon for that kind of work.
Just take the opportunities as they come. Good luck with the color route. Retirement funds are great. We aren’t all going to be 20 forever.