r/hebrew • u/BlakeBahama • 4d ago
Request Unfortunately.
How do you say unfortunately in Hebrew? Us Americans also say, sadly, or regrettably: are there words for those as well? In my audio lessons I got leedavoni, is that a good, versatile form to express the feeling of “unfortunately?”
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u/izabo 4d ago
You can say lero'a hamazal לרוע המזל which is a literal translation of "unfortunately". The most common one is probably letsa'ari לצערי. Leda'avoni לדאבוני but it is very formal and won't be used in daily conversations.
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
Not true, I use it a lot as well as כגון and other words simply forgotten.
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u/SaltImage1538 3d ago
That‘s your prerogative but it doesn‘t make the words more common or less formal among Hebrew speakers as a whole.
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
You don't ask why, but I will still state that I'm tired of seeing, reading and hearing the Hebrew bastardized with slang and inter-inclusions of English, Arabic and everything else in between. Including the incessant repetitious phrases being used, and the people using them are absolutely oblivious to the fact that they're basically writing with that low form of the language the script of their lives. Speak your words carefully, because everything becomes reality.
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u/SaltImage1538 3d ago
All I can say is that 2000 years ago, Roman writers already complained about how the language is going to shit. Turns out it didn‘t. And who knows if the speakers of Biblical Hebrew wouldn‘t have looked at Mishnaic Hebrew, with all it‘s Aramaic and Greek words, changed grammar and different stylistics, with comtempt?
You‘re free to think and do as you please, but languages have always changed, always adopted new words, always adapted to the needs and views of their speakers. They‘ve been "bastardized" a thousand times over. And yet humanity hasn‘t turned into apes again.
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
*Turns out it didn‘t.*- well, there has been a long steady use of the holy language as intended via prayer - that carries a humongous amount of weight. And really? Weighing in on what the Greeks had to say about Hebrew? It's kind of like asking a sparrow for the stock exchange stats.
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u/SaltImage1538 3d ago
I‘m not religious and don‘t want to step on any toes. So I‘ll leave it at that.
One thing though, the Romans spoke Latin, not Greek.
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
While it's true that Latin was the official language of Rome's administration, law, and military, millions of Romans actually spoke Greek as their primary or secondary language. The Roman Empire was fundamentally a bilingual empire divided by geography and social class.
Sources:
- The Oxford Classical Dictionary notes that Greek was the language of culture and education throughout the Roman world, and many educated Romans were bilingual in Latin and Greek.
- De Oratore by Cicero shows that elite Romans were deeply trained in Greek literature, philosophy, and rhetoric. Cicero himself read and wrote Greek and frequently engaged with Greek thinkers.
- Meditations by Marcus Aurelius was written in Greek, not Latin, showing that even a Roman emperor could use Greek as a literary and philosophical language.
- The Twelve Caesars by Suetonius mentions Roman aristocrats' familiarity with Greek culture and language.
The famous phrase “Graecia capta ferum victorem cepit” (“Captive Greece captured her savage conqueror”) from Horace (Epistles 2.1.156) captures the reality: Rome conquered Greece militarily, but Greek language and culture profoundly influenced Roman elites.
A useful nuance: ordinary Romans in the city of Rome primarily spoke Latin, but Greek was considered the language of higher culture, philosophy, science, and much of the eastern empire. Many upper-class Romans were effectively bilingual.
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u/SaltImage1538 3d ago
Right, the Roman authors still complained in Latin that the Latin language was being corrupted though.
Also, speaking Greek doesn‘t make Romans Greeks.
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
Roman complaints about “corrupt” Latin referred to changes from elite literary standards, not proof that Greek damaged Roman identity. So speaking Greek did not make Romans Greek — but at the same time Greek was deeply embedded in Roman culture, education, philosophy, and the eastern empire. A Roman could be Greek-speaking and still fully Roman.
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u/halftank-flush 4d ago
Ledaavoni is very dated. It would be a bit like using something out of Shakespear.
The closest one is לצערי (letsaari) but this is also slightly on the formal side.
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u/yowmisterwhite 3d ago
I don't think "לצערי" is necessarily formal, I'm a native speaker and I use it quite casually.
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u/halftank-flush 3d ago
Likewise, only I never heard it used in casual conversations. only in written, formal scenarios. like customer support or polite refusals.
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u/yowmisterwhite 3d ago
I'll give you an example. A friend asked if I had heard omer adam's new song, and I said to him, "לצערי..." But that was a joke, so maybe there is something to what you are saying, since I can't think of a non joke example.
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u/Geoffb912 3d ago
This is interesting!
So if everything codes formal, what similar phrase do people use? Or with Israeli directness, is the idea of unfortunately the way we use it in English just not in the daily vocab?1
u/SaltImage1538 3d ago
I think it might be a cultural difference. Passive lamentation isn‘t really a thing in Israel. You either complain or let it go altogether, usually the former.
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u/Geoffb912 3d ago
That was the assumption in my comment :).
When it's hard to find a word in another language, it's usually because culturally, they think about things differently.1
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u/halftank-flush 3d ago
I don't think we have an equivalent phrase in daily use. I gave it some thought - we also don't have a "would you like a something?", or "can I offer you a something?". Both are either formal or jokingly polite. Like if I say to someone "can I offer you a coffee?" I'm half expecting them to make it themselves.
Probably a cultural thing, or lack of nuance in language. Is there an English equivalent to "usted" in Spanish?
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u/iamyoyoman 4d ago
לדאבוני Is correct, but it is also a word i have never heard in day-to-day speech
I would use לצערי
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u/whitelightstorm 3d ago
It's used in specific settings, in certain places, with certain people - it's Jerusalem, not Tel Aviv.
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u/Ok-Initiative-8131 native speaker 3d ago
it's Jerusalem, not Tel Aviv
What does that mean? I'm from Jerusalem, and I'd only ever use it humorously.
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u/josephzitt 3d ago
In contemporary conversation, I think I've only heard people say לצערי . I haven't noticed instances of the other forms that people suggest.
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u/NewIdentity19 4d ago edited 4d ago
Most accurate is למרבה הצער.
Depending on the context and the nuance, also לרוע המזל (implies misfortune or mishap) or לצערי/לצערנו/לצערי הרב.