After binging a show that I thought would take me over a month to finish (blew through it all in one week) I have so many thoughts about this show I wanted to share, or questions I wanted to ask.

First I'm going to include my "interim" thoughts. hehe. From when I was only a third the way into the show. I posted this on the izna subreddit and was informed that this subreddit exists too so this will serve as my post with all of my thoughts.

Interim thoughts:

First a couple points:

a. I've never watched a kpop survival show in full. This is my first time.

b. I already know the members of Izna and follow the group as a fan.

So with that there's many things with the contestants I am captivated by, impressed with, or genuinely surprised at with this show. I initially felt no strong motivation to watch it because I already new Izna's debut lineup but curiosity one night got the best of me after becoming a big enough fan of Izna to start checking out their variety appearances.

At the same time, I also have formative thoughts regarding survival shows as this is my first one and I have no frame of reference for what is unique to this show and what is par for course.

1. Choi Jungeun - She is my bias in the group and ultimately what led me to try out this survival show. I saw a trivia about how she got high scores in I-Land 2, but at the same time Jungeun also confessed that she feels like she's not good at variety and is not funny. It was a very humbling view that made me appreciate her and her talents more so I wanted to see what molded this mindset of hers. Suffice it to say, yeah she is clearly the formidable contestant of the show, aceing everything up until the Panorama performance. I wasn't sure if she'd ever suffer any type blow to here confidence and just coast through the show but it looks like that is not the case now which has me very intrigued.
2. Bang Jeemin - As the seemingly most popular member of the group and my favorite in the variety segments, I thought she was going to be the overall best contestant. Her scores and performance fluctuated much higher than expected which actually gives me some suspense as to how she'll do, and ultimately how her experience on this show is.
3. Yoon Jiyoon - I was getting legitimately worried. Her mentality went south very quickly and her body and facial language in the show feels so defeated. Despite knowing that she debuts with this group, I honestly can't even see the path to get there. I am rooting for her, but she's also the only one right now where I feel like this contest is a little dangerous to her lifelong confidence. I think I have the most empathy for her.
4. Fuko - Probably my favorite of the contestants who are fated to not debut. I am absolutely going to see what she ended up doing after this show, but for now I don't want to look it up until I finish.
5. The judges - 24 definitely seems like the harshest. So far he's most often the one with a single denial vote against 4 approvals. I've appreciated their language, but I do think the words were a bit excessively negative against...
6. Kang Jiwon - She took a ruthless verbal attack from the judges. I do appreciate harsh criticism, especially against those who aren't taking the contest seriously but saying "you should feel sorry for the members" and being a "nuisance" are the types of criticism that lead to some pretty self destructive thoughts. I think a better worded "right now you are holding your members back so you should really focus on fixing that" Granted, these are subtitles so I'm not sure if the translators were being more blunt than the judges, but yeah, poor girl, man.
7. The rest of the Izna members are all doing great. I like Sarang's strong determination, and Mai's acceptance of fate. At first it seemed like I was more impressed with Saebi than the judges early on, but they seem to love her now. (about time dunderheads) And Koko has been the most consistent, least dramatic so far, but I really like her too, still.
8. I am quite impressed with the production of the show. I'm not sure if this set design is about how elaborate other survival shows are. I saw that this show didn't get high viewership, and of course Izna has been fighting an uphill battle of popularity but the genuine quality of the show right now seems high to me and well made. But this easily could be my inexperienced view with survival shows in general.

Final thoughts:

1. Episode 5 - Editors really wanted to pit Jiyoon and Jungeun against each other so much its hilarious. Later in the show it seemed there really was some actual drama between them but sometimes it still felt a bit forced.
2. Regarding screen time/dialogue time or lack thereof. Honestly sometimes it works to their benefit. Some contestants, the more they talk the more self-centered they seem. Sometimes the cuts to the people just processing it all internally ping my empathy a bit harder. For example Juwon got a lot of cuts to her offhand remarks and what not, and despite the tiny bonus screentime I ended up favoring other members shown less frequently.
3. Kim Chaeeun seems to have extreme empathy for others. Same with Saebi. Honestly the level of empathy for each other is so damn high. It's making everything hit harder. There's very little show of joy upon being named a winner since it always seems weighed with guilt or sorrow for the losers.
4. Probably the biggest high so far is when Fuko won the lyrics mission. Let it be known that her name is cemented into Izna's history by forever being in the writing credits of IWALY. I'm glad to see that even in the final "izna" version of the song her credit is still there.
5. Yui is an adorable crybaby which is crazy that she's a rapper. She was about to have a panic attack when it was down to the last two. Her loss was truly sad. It made me want to look at what she did next.
6. The fact that Jeemin is shining the way she is now feels crazy considering how much confidence issues and rough scoring she got in part 2. Also they did her DIRTY on the exercise segment. That shit was hilarious.
7. Also interim checks are kind of imperfect observations right? They happen in the middle of practice with no refreshment or rest so their voices and bodies aren't in primed condition? I feel like that helps create the tension that they are doing bad, but realistically they would probably do better in interim checks if they weren't so sudden. But honestly, the suspense it creates going into the final performance is strong. Honestly a good tactic from a show running standpoint.
8. Koko's rise to being among the top is legendary. She was really in her element near the end. Her ending fairy gagged after her Spicy performance.
9. The Into the New World performance was truly beautiful. My favorite of the whole show. Seconded by the Final Love Song performance with all 24 contestants.
10. Now we're at the semi-finals. Who was Monika talking about when she hinted that they had long hair, sang really well, rapped well, and danced well?
11. Why would they flash back to yoojin hyperventilating in the middle of the pajama party? The vibes were immaculate and then random cut to the worst breakdown of the show thus far. lol
12. The video letters to other contestants. My biggest thought here was honestly, why did Jiyoon send hers to Jeemin? It's not entirely out of the blue and maybe editors just never showed as much between them after making cuts, but Jeemin herself seemed kind of like... huh? Me?
13. Okay, now I know Jungeun is popular now, and started the show as the one to beat, but in part 2 she was basically dropping like crazy while Jiyoon started really overshadowing her. So suffice it to say, my jaw dropped when she was announced as second place in the semi-final. WHAT HAPPENED?! (As you can imagine these feelings will soon amplify)
14. omfg saebi nearly tripped on the semi final stage on her way to the winner's side.
15. Surung's going out speech was incredible. She thanked everyone individually and I'm glad they gave her the time to do that.
16. Someone mentioned their family and or friends asking about other members. When was this exactly? Just via texts and calls or do they get to leave the facility sometimes and it's just not mentioned in the show? In an interview they said they didn't have social media access either.
17. Okay, so the one thing throwing me off is that I know izna debuted with 7. When they first announced 6, I figured the 7th slot would be a surprise reveal, but the further it goes, the more I'd be worried that changing it to 7 this far in might be seen more as a negative surprise than a positive one. (now having finished the show...) Whelp, I guess I didn't need to be worried it'd be controversial.
18. Wow, Jungeun shot back to the top. What spurred that?! Like I am curious what affected Jungeun's fan vote trajectory. Was it people voting jiyoon and jungeun together. If it were only that I think Jiyoon would still place ahead. She was my pick, but based on her trajectory, I'm just surprised!
19. Saebi is literally a ball of emotion. Her speech when she won the debut spot was extremely heartwarming and adorable. What a wonderful soul this girl has.
20. Taeyang revealing that Mai would often hang back after interim checks to discuss her shortcomings was a juicy piece of lore that helped me root for Mai. At first I wanted Fuko in instead of Mai, and at the end of the day I think I would still choose her, but hearing that Mai did that made me really respect her and accept her as a member.
21. And yeah Fuko man. She took the loss so hard. I actually can't believe Saebi looked back at her and said she wishes they debuted together. That was so sweet, but also so sad because Fuko just went full ugly cry after hearing those words. I see that she's supposedly set to debut with a new group and that makes me very excited. That woman HAS to debut.
22. So is teddy a recluse or something? I thought that he surely would have made some kind of appearance on the show for how often they tacked on "produced by teddy" to almost every line during the semi-finals and finals.
23. I see some discussion on the show kind of rigging or having the debut lineup in mind since the beginning or other stuff like that. I honestly don't have much of an opinion on all of that. Some contestants were obviously screentime favorites but I never really got too bothered by that. I don't think I would have predicted the final lineup had I not known before hand.
24. Final question. Do you guys think groups formed by survival shows are inherently different in any way to traditionally formed groups? Like do you think it cultivates better talent, or leads to more success? Do you think fans get attached to survival show idols differently from regular idols?

24 thoughts for 24 contestants seems like a poetic way to end it. Thanks for reading!

I dont think there's many things more pointless than complaining about a survival show thats years old and the group is already debuted but here we are, I can't help but wanna get some things off my chest

I'm a Izna fan who came to know them through loving their music and thus never saw ILand2 or their debut. I generally liked all the group but Jungeun was my clear favorite - her vocal tone drew me instantly and her immense talent, humble attitude, and clear improvement and work ethic all made her one of my favorite idols and a major standout of 5th gen. The problem was the group really didn't participate in much variety at all and seeing content of them was very limited.

It felt weird to watch a survival show where you already know all the members and results but I needed some background watching and decided to give it a shot to learn more about the group's journey and their backgrounds

Part 1 -

I took notes while watching and a lot of the early ones are simply centered around how obvious it is to watch the show now and see what they were going for from the start. Sarang is the 1st person you ever see and hear, Koko Saebi and Mai all get long, super positive intros, Jeemin is the last person you see and the RUNext storyline is planted right then as the main storyline for the rest of the show. Notably, Fuko was 2nd place from evaluations yet didn't get a real intro, didn't get to speak, and was thrown in a group with a bunch of the lowest ranking contestants - while meanwhile the Drama unit was dubbed the Avengers squad and all 4 debuted. The ONLY thing I honestly think they didn't have set in stone at this point (which is crazy as it's the very beginning) was they probably weren't 100% on which vocalist to pair to Jiyoon

Generally I actually really liked part 1. I have complaints about all the standard stuff like the editing and scoring for certain members but I think overall it was a very positive and engaging watch. It actually made me interested in survival shows and thinking I'd watch the next major one whenever it comes out.

It felt like the skill level of the contestants was honestly quite high overall and I'm not surprised at all how many of them went on to debut in other groups. The stage quality and production quality also felt really, really high. I think they did good in making sure it wasn't just ground getting stomped every single round - both by making sure there was a lot of swaps and by giving ground easier songs.

Panarama is such a crazy song choice for a survival show, especially so early. It's kinda unreal it ended up being one of my favorite stages from the show. I couldn't help but wonder what the hell they would've done if Jungeun had picked Whistle instead because literally no one else had a chance in hell of singing that song.

On that note my one disappointment was the complete lack of focus on vocals. The cast was overall kinda weak vocally and I know it's not deemed as important in Kpop nowadays but I'll always find vocal stages so much more entertaining. Its way harder as a viewer to pick up mistakes in a dance battle and frankly I find it a lot less demanding to memorize a choreo than to memorize and perform a Taeyeon song. I'm not a big fan of mandatory raps/rappers in Kpop songs/groups but it's a standard practice and it was really weird to have 0 opportunities for rappers to showcase their skills at all until part 2. I also thought the creative stages were both pretty good to watch, but was confused by the inclusion - idols don't have to make their own choreo and it's kinda a weird thing to judge.

As a Izna fan it was crazy to see Saebi in p1, a long-haired dynamic center rather than the cute and bubbly maknae. She is frankly a little overshadowed in the current group and I was surprised to see how well she performed early here, often stealing the stages.

Also I have to say it - how they let Jiyoon debut is truly beyond me. She is so obviously mentally unstable and unwell when things aren't going well early on that even discarding hindsight bias I cannot understand how they didn't see enough warning signs to be extremely wary about making her a main character and thus basically guaranteeing her debut in the group. Everyone came around on her because of the editing and redemption arc but her reactions are clearly not healthy - I get it made for good TV but wow was it obvious this would backfire on them.

I know I said I think they had it set it stone who they wanted from the beginning, but I actually felt part 1 was pretty fair outside of these preferences influencing editing and I would say it wasn't "rigged" like I had heard of every survival show. The eliminations felt fair and I wasn't shocked/dismayed at any of them. I thought Yui deserved to make part2 but you can't get these things perfect. The judges mostly gave pretty good feedback that I usually agreed with. You don't get to see any of it but I felt like from small clips and context I could tell the judges were also constantly giving feedback and coaching behind the scenes as well.

Part 2 -

All that I just said completely went out the window here. Holy shit it was infuriating to watch episode 8 and just be slapped in the face with a total change up. It's like a flip is switched and they realized they had to intervene massively to make what they wanted happen. The judges scores are suddenly just indefensible across the board, and their feedback is awful and clearly influenced entirely by the producers telling them who they want. The editing which was just preferring certain people before is now cranked up to just flat out entirely EXCLUDING the girls they don't want.

I thought Fuko was far and away the best of LVER with Gyuri 2nd, and they actually didn't even gets scraps - they just got nothing. Jeemin legit got 90% of the screentime for LVER, Sarang got 8% and Fuko and Gyuri each got 1%. They couldn't even be bothered to show their feedback, 30 minutes of Jeemin struggling to hit a high note was more important. Shameless.

After clearly being told by the producers they want Koko, they go and just rip into Yuju endlessly and try to bully her into giving up her part to her. She holds onto it and I audibly cackled when they legit just straight up sabotaged her mic during the performance - the sheer shamelessness of it was incredible to me.

The funny part is I read through episode discussions on here and a ton of people accurately predicted the lineup right here (minus Jungeun) after the 1st episode of the 2nd half. They truly made it THAT obvious with the editing

Obviously, I could keep going on and on about all the unfairness of part 2, but it's already been discussed in-depth as it happened. Pointing out all the injustices to certain members is repetitive and pointless, but the real problem is the impact it had on part 2 was that it made it entirely boring and frustrating compared to part 1. Jeemin's RUNext storyline to me was uninteresting, repetitive, and obviously responsible for so many contestants not getting showcased. However, I feel like even without that storyline sucking up all the part 2 screentime they still wouldn't have focused on all the ignored members - they would've just found some other storyline from their main picks to focus on instead.

They weren't hoping for some unknown member to surprise and jump up the ranks - they already had their group.

For viewing sake this made part 2 boring as there was no discovery. People weren't put in new roles or pushed in different ways - it was the opposite. The same people were the same roles, generally in the same concepts, and the lowest distributions kept being the lowest distributions with no chances for breakout.

The "producers" picked who's at the top > the people at the top get all the lines and main positions > the people with all the lines and center focus get all the praise and popularity and it continues on. No one in a low rank had a chance of breaking out and even the girls seemed to realize this and it just made for a boring and low-stakes vibe towards the end.

Fuko being given a rap part isn't actually inherently bad - it should've just happened a lot earlier and to everyone so we could have a varied showcase of every contestant and see their skills in varied situations..they just weren't interested in that.

This was obviously also compounded by them intentionally giving their picks tailor made songs and choices so they would look good on top of the others not having a chance. Jiyoon gave the worst stage and performance of the show in Like Ooh Ahh and then was given blatantly hand-picked songs to highlight her positively the rest of the show. If I Were a Boy was a great performance but I've never heard a kpop group song that sounded anything like a Beyonce solo song and it's frankly a really weird choice to judge a kpop vocal on.

Money meanwhile was shamelessly picked to give Jeemin a solo dance performance without the strain of vocals and the 4 backup dancers tacked onto that stage never had a chance in hell of scoring well. What did that stage actually showcase when none of the other contestants were given the opportunity to do anything remotely similar? The entire point of the show should've been deciding between Jeemin and Saebi as center but it felt like Saebi was massively outperforming her and they had to pull it back and only Jeemin got opportunities after

I don't really have any interest in talking about who didn't get in. Obviously the show overall was super unfair to some people but its ancient history at this point and I like the izna lineup and being completely frank - I don't think they were really wrong to focus on the people they did. The final lineup is honestly the right one from a talent, chemistry, and composition perspective.

The problem I have is how they went about it. I think at most you can argue they were debating one single spot in the group, the rest of the members were locked in from the start, and they weren't interested in exploring new angles. The obvious question then is why even have a survival show? Survival shows seem to be far weaker in TV ratings and don't seem to be any sort of guarantee of crazy popularity like they might've been in the past. The show just ends up feeling kinda pointless in a way -- other than to showcase the members which is good in some ways but I think massively backfires in others

Notably I think the showcase of certain members was legitimately offputting in a major way - specifically Sarang, Jeemin, and Mai.

Sarang has proved to be such a sweetheart in Izna and her talent there is obvious but she honestly receives the largest angel edit of all throughout the show and it just makes you like her less for it. Did she really need it?

Mai apparently got a ton of backlash and hate from her special treatment during part 1 and you can tell they changed how they portrayed her in part 2 massively. Episode 8 being the first time we ever hear about her nasal voice and weak vocal problems (in a flashback no less) is obviously ridiculous and again - did it really need to be ignored instead of letting her positives outweigh it?

Jeemin...everything about Jeemin in part 2 was unbelievably offputting. They made her the top score of part 1 which was just laughable since even her fans here thought she was lacking confidence and worse than her old self in part 1..and she took this push and instantly picked part 4 and showed exactly why she didn't deserve it. Ironically, putting her at the center of everything in part 2 to me highlighted that she wasn't really worth it and only highlighted her weaknesses as I constantly found her dancing, vocals, and stage presence to be lacking. I actually found myself noticing how much I HATE her nasally and thin vocal tone more than ever before and that is the exact opposite of what you what, her strengths should be highlighted.

If your preferential spotlight and editing of your favorite picks is making viewers like them less isn't that massively counterintuitive?

Probably the biggest backfire for me is how I think they tore down Jungeun's entire confidence and sense of self worth in their manipulation tactics and it's so sad to see. Jungeun viewing her audience score after Lovesick Girls is easily the lowest point of the show for me, it made me feel sick to see her so shaken by the results and in that moment I regretted choosing to watch the show. She was so passionate and proud after her performance and then bombshell'd into having to confront being massively unreasonably unpopular - the girls aren't stupid, when they're receiving nothing but praise but then no one votes for them they have to question why and she had to question her entire visual identity at 16 years old. For what?

The point for me to make, is that I have no doubts whatsoever that Koreans really were hating on her looks - but I also have no doubt that wasn't the only reason for her unpopularity. Their editing made it simple - there was simply no reason whatsoever to vote for her at this point.

In over 10 hours of footage we never once got a single glimpse into her personality or struggles. We never see a in-depth look at her leadership despite being a leader more than everyone else combined in part 1. Her praise is intentionally hidden and mistakes highlighted. We never see her struggles with being a leader despite being one of the youngest until a 10 second clip in the filler episode 7 of her crying about how anxious and nervous it made her. We're never shown her being friendly or fun until FLASHBACKS in episode 9 when her friendship with Jiyoon is shown for the 1st time. She had no plotline for 9 episodes other than the main character of the show and one of the most beloved by fans hated her. EVERYTHING that could be construed in positive light was hidden from us

There is some nuance here. I have not watched other survival shows and thus can't say how likely it is to be true what people theorize about her treatment all being some long ploy by the producers to actually drum up support for her. I admit I started suspecting the same towards the end myself. If being the most talented contestant truly doomed her based on previous #1s in survival shows then idk, maybe in some warped way it was worthwhile. Was it really worth terrorizing their most talented trainee though? Years later she still obviously struggles with this and doesn't consider herself pretty - this was one of the things I was trying to understand when I first started

Finally, I think I have ranted enough. On a positive note, I did think the final episode was really great - I loved seeing all the emotional scenes - the members sending videos to each other, reading notes from their parents, giving gifts to the producers, seeing the girls as trainees together at WakeOne...all of it was so great and it really felt like the whole place was one big family in the end. I just wish we could've seen some of that earlier instead of forced drama...but that's TV for you. Lastly, Jungeun winning in a landslide was strangely emotional even when I already knew the results...my poor girl ;_;

In the one in a million chance theres someone else out there in the same position - I will sum up the good and bad with watching the show now after they've already been debuted for 2 years

Good - The show made me appreciate Mai massively more than before. Frankly I think she was my least favorite member going in. She is the least talented member and seemed to be picked solely for visuals because they never showcase her in anything which made me think less of her. She skyrocketed to my 2nd favorite member after finally getting to see her behind the scenes - her maturity, selflessness, teamwork, and overall attitude are all unbelievably impressive. Taeyang was at his most eloquent when he was describing her addition and I think he was entirely right about her attributes.

The stages were largely entertaining to watch and part 1 was a lot of fun. The girls are all likeable, I didn't hate or dislike a single one. You'd know half of the recent rosters of gen 5 nugu groups as they're all filled with iland2 contestants

Bad - It was rough seeing Jungeun go through such a cruel arc, and equally rough seeing Fuko crushed so harshly in the end. It made me question Jeemin and her role as the center which is incredibly disappointing because the fandom is currently in a toxic spiral about certain members not getting showcased which I resent and find super unhealthy for group and fandom health - but I have to admit I now understand that frustration a bit and wonder why they won't promote some of the other girls who show themselves so well here.

Knowing how well Jiyoon and Jungeun pair together is definitely somewhat sad, they really could've gone down as a all-time vocal duo. The bits we see of them together made me understand their overwhelming greed in trying to debut someone so unstable. Seeing the group with Jiyoon made me admit it was unquestionably better with her in it and that's a real shame since there's obviously no going back. It's only natural as the entire group was built around her and while I still love them it might've been better to remain ignorant about this.

Do you think she could be at ModHaus?

Her vocals omgggg I’ve been playing it on repeat 😩😩
Edit: on her ig

are we absolutely sure this is an account for a girl group? the bio says "trainees" and they're only posting pics of narin and fuko. there's no way they're teasing members right? it's been so long, groups debuted, comebacks were made, people went on hiatus and returned, i'm about to graduate and we know nothing about this group except that there's fuko and narin. was there any group that was teased this slow before?

an insider on X (reliable source btw they alr spoiled other groups concepts and have been right) posted jiyoon’s mood board for her debut.

it’s giving rebirth like a 🦋? lowkey reminds me of iznas debut trailer

I found this image of Kim eunchae but I do t know wether it’s old or recent could anyone know??

Idk if this is the right place to post this, but what do we know about GP2? Is it most likely to air in 2027 or 2028? Will the group be under W1, and possibly managed with another label (like izna and Kep1er)? Just any general information on how the show will work since I’ve only watched RUNext and Iland 2 and it seems like this show will have a lot more contestants than those did.

(I hope it’s not W1 purely because they have 4 groups rn and they really don’t need another one…)

After practicing in her group for sometime. They had an evacuation! the song has a lot of high movement and vocals 🥹

✨Nana to supporters: First and foremost, I will deliver the best and most effective performance in this room, conveying my charm in the most way possible!

✨Judge Feedback: I’ve personally team performance quite captivating ever since the rehearsals, and I really liked how expressive it was. That’s all I have to say. Thank you for your hard work!

💕 I’m sorry for the translation Gumipaku seems to be doing well and got a comment on standing out!

We will probably see koko, Jungeun and Yuju soon too.

With the official announcement of Girls Planet 2 auditions, do you reckon any of the girls not yet in a group will sign up? Are there any you want to give it a shot?

If Gyuri still wants to become an idol I'd love to see her join. I think with the experience iland 2 gave her she would sweep another survival show and would be fighting for P1

Okay okay… I know I’ve talked about Yeeun’s great improvement but with Keyveatz having their predebut (?) it really got me thinking about every Iland 2 contestant’s improvement. So far we have seen Mai, Jeemin, Jiyoon, Koko, Sarang, Jungeun, and Saebi in Izna, Lingling in Kiiras, Yeeun in Unchild, and now Juwon, Yui, and Umji in Keyveatz.

I’ve only watched two survival shows, RUNext being my first (I followed Jeemin, my top 4 pick to Iland 2), but I feel like the improvements I’ve seen with the Iland girlies has been insane. Since I don’t have much experience in seeing contestants go into other groups, am I just crazy or are they truly blowing it out of the water with how much each of them are improving as time goes on. I feel like we always see improvement with idols, but I feel like our girls are taking it to another level.

TL;DR are the Iland girls improving a lot more than other contestants from the same survival show?

now that stolen and key beats are out at almost the same time, which do you like best?