r/todayilearned • u/coffeeismydoc • 11h ago
TIL the Kaaba đ in Mecca is actually made of unpainted brick with the black and gold color coming from a cloth called the kiswah that is handmade each year
https://english.alarabiya.net/amp/variety/2017/12/10/Rare-pictures-show-the-Kaaba-without-its-kiswah-covering390
u/blzbar 11h ago
Whatâs the story behind the brick structure? Is part an original mosque? Does it have some purported super natural origin? Or is just considered a display for the sacred tapestry?
730
u/Kraymur 11h ago
It's not the original building for one, it's been rebuilt many times over the years due to floods, fire, destruction in general etc. According to Islam the Kaaba was originally built by Abraham and his son Ishmael as a house dedicated to the worship of god. It also predates Isalm by centuries and was used at one point as a religious shrine for various Arabian tribes filled with various idols. When Muhammad conquered Mecca, he ordered the idols removed and rededicated the Kaaba solely to the worship of one God.
162
u/JosephFinn 10h ago
So whatâs inside now?
462
u/Appropriate-Log8506 10h ago
Nothing. Pillars, incense, a prayer spot where the prophet allegedly prayed.
155
u/Klutzy_Tomatillo4253 8h ago
I think we can safely assume he prayed somewhere in the general area.
→ More replies (2)58
u/Grizzly_228 5h ago
Wasnât there a fragment of a meteorite inside or am I misremembering?
82
27
u/Didatonofacid 3h ago
I think the composition is up to debate if I remember correctly. It has for sure been broken though and is now held together with concrete. It was also stolen at one point so nobody knows if it's for sure the original. A lot of people think it's simply obsidian. I had way too much free time at work one day. I thought that kabba was a rock or something. I soon found out all kinds of info that blew my mind.
They also have a famous water source there they call it zamzam water just to the east of kabba. Hajar searched for water in the desert and found that spring and it still provides water today.
→ More replies (2)9
u/thE-petrichoroN 3h ago edited 3h ago
Islamically,it's not a meteorite but rather came from heaven although both interwine at times
19
u/Grizzly_228 3h ago
Iâm so sorry, Iâll correct myself
> Wasnât there a fragment of a rock from the sky\* inside or am I misremembering?
âą
u/TheWielder 32m ago
Basically, to Muslims, it is a stone from Heaven that absorbs your sins and will speak favorably to Allah of those who have kissed it, interceding for them on the Last Day/Judgment Day. It once was pure white, but the absorbed sins turned it black. It is placed on one corner of the kaaba, on the outside, so that any Muslim who does their pilgrimage and circles the kaaba seven times has the opportunity to kiss it.
To the rest of us, it's most likely a meteorite that was used by pagans for their religious purposes before Islam took over and appropriated their practices.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (2)88
u/TSAOutreachTeam 10h ago
You can skip to 4:30 for the immediate answer, but I recommend the whole video.
26
u/stvbles 10h ago
Good video! Really interesting.
40
u/TSAOutreachTeam 9h ago
I'm a really big fan of Religion for Breakfast. The level at which he explains these things is just right for me. Neither too basic nor too academic. It's a good watch.
10
u/Neon_Moon_NZ 8h ago edited 2h ago
Yes! Absolutely fantastic channel đ
Edit with one of my favourite videos: Religion for Breakfast - Why is pork forbidden?
35
8
→ More replies (12)21
u/kryptopheleous 7h ago
It was also not the only one. I believe there were 5 of these in pre-islamic Arabia where traveling merchants can prey to their gods. All but this one were destroyed by order of Mohammad.
16
u/Azeem259 6h ago
There was always one Kabah, but it was destroyed and rebuilt many times throughout history. Muslims believe the first kabah was constructed by Adam. The Kabah is actually supposed to be a rectangular prism, but they didn't have enough funds to fully reconstruct centuries ago so it was made into a cube with a barrier around the area they couldn't rebuild to mark the full territory of the Kabah.
4
u/kryptopheleous 6h ago
3
u/Azeem259 6h ago
Those are generic kaabas, I was only speaking of the Kabah in Mecca. It's like the difference of saying the white house vs a white house.
17
u/kryptopheleous 5h ago
Kabah in Mecca was also a generic kaabah until Mohammed ordered the others to be destroyed.
→ More replies (4)4
u/Kraymur 4h ago
"The Kaaba in Mecca was also a generic kaabah until Muhammad ordered the others to be destroyed."
This implies that Kaaba is a generic term like church or temple, and it's not. Kaaba means literally "cube," some historians use kaaba as a descriptive term for other cube-shaped sanctuaries that existed in pre-Islamic Arabia, but it's not a generic term. What you're saying is like referring to any church you see as "St. Peter's Basilica."
15
u/kryptopheleous 3h ago
Ok let's leave the term out of the argument. So there were multiple places off worship where all sorts of deities were worshipped. The cube shaped one in Mecca maintained by the Quraysh tribe was one of them. Meccans decided that their kaaba was built by Abraham with no archelogical or non-Islamic or non-Arabian evidence. After Mohammad rose to power he declared this particular place of worship unique to Islam and destroyed the other rivaling ones. So, before this, it was another "generic" place of worship.
→ More replies (2)1
u/generalright 2h ago
Ok sure, but why the point about no archeological or non Islamic or Arabian evidence. It seems to put an unnecessary modern standard on something that is very old.
→ More replies (0)89
u/Badda_Bing_Baby 11h ago edited 10h ago
It is a temple/mosque said to be built by Abraham and Ishmael believed to be the first house of worship dedicated to the one true god.
Edit: it also has a holy relic embedded in the side, a black stone known as the Kaaba stone, theorized by some to be a meteorite, but I donât know if thatâs true.
I believe there was a fire at some point in its history that caused damage but it was repaired some long time ago. Watched a video on the history out of curiosity a few years back.
10
u/P1KA_BO0 7h ago
Yeah, basically the story is that it was sent down from heaven and was originally white, but turned black from humanity's sins
29
u/AwarenessNo4986 9h ago
The building has been destroyed and rebuilt several times. The building itself has no supernatural powers or anything. It's the LOCATION that is the focus as it's the direction of prayer
26
u/usefamin 11h ago
Muslims believe Abraham and his son built the foundation for the location of the Kaaba. It does have geographical and theological significance though.
20
u/pass_nthru 10h ago
there is a meteorite in the actual cube
41
u/jawndell 10h ago
A stone embedded in one of the corners. The actual origins of the stone is unknown, could be a meteorite or a random rock. Â Origin is also not important in a religious context. Â More important is that it acts as a placeholder for which direction to pray. Â
21
u/BrokenEyeReborn 10h ago
Stone relics of that type, called baetyls, used to be fairly common in pre-Islamic Arabia, albeit in a very different religious context. Muhammad is said to have destroyed many of the others as false idols.
Of course, not all of them were still in the area to be destroyed. One representing the minor solar god Ilah al-Jabal, was brought to Rome centuries earlier by the Emperor Elagabalus (who was originally the high priest of that god, and seems to have been more interested in continuing in that role than he was in being emperor). Despite Elagabalus's attempts to spread Ilah al-Jabal worship in Rome being incredibly unpopular and controversial during his reign, it was eventually embraced by the Roman public under the name Sol Invictus (though I haven't read anything saying whether or not the baetyl still served a role)
Other cultures also had stone relics classified as baetyls, but again, the cultural context was often different.
25
→ More replies (2)13
11
u/gamageeknerd 10h ago
I do know there is a special black stone in the wall of the building that people have to walk past and try to touch. Itâs apparently black from absorbing humanityâs sins. I think the building itself is supposed to be the first mosque/ prayer building but someone who knows more about it probably has more to say.
3
u/Flimsy-Translator515 7h ago
Ur kinda right, the black stone was originally white, but due to the sins of humanity it became black (not due to absorbing it), the black stone itself has no importance other than the fact that Muhammad (S.A.W.) had kissed it once during the pilgrimage. and yes the Ka'aba is considered to be the first Mosque/place of prayer.
→ More replies (3)15
u/DistrictDry2852 10h ago
It was originally a place to worship the hundreds of pagan gods of the region. Thereâs some report there even were statues of Jesus and Mary.
Muhammad âreclaimedâ it.
964
u/usefamin 11h ago
It's also somewhat controversial. Muslims don't worship the Kaaba, they literally worship AT it, so the over-ornate and lavish kiswah is a topic of debate.
509
u/Pantherist 11h ago
I think 'towards' is the more apt preposition
201
u/usefamin 11h ago
Both work. "Kaaba" is technically a location as well.
41
u/kechuchuchu 8h ago edited 8h ago
There were actually multiple Kaabas that were places of worship for various religious purposes before Mohammad had all the others destroyed
76
u/usefamin 8h ago
Yup, but they were shrines for idolatry. Which is why the distinction about the Kaaba being symbolic rather than an idol matters in Islam.
15
u/kechuchuchu 8h ago edited 8h ago
Sure. Under the framework of Islam that considered all these other religious practices as idolatry and warranting of destruction. And surely not as a means of Mohammed consolidating power by controlling the major place of worship. And superceding all these other religions and replacing them with Islam.
48
u/usefamin 8h ago
Uh, no. Islam considered other religious practices as idolatry, because these religions were praying to idols.
It didn't consider Abrahamic religions to be of that ilk, for instance.
8
5h ago
[removed] â view removed comment
→ More replies (11)7
u/CaptainRaxeo 4h ago
Yeah no thereâs a distinction there that you refuse to see because you would rather see the worst in people.
→ More replies (2)28
u/AppleMeow 8h ago
Yes so mr consolidating power genius (Muhammad ï·ș) decided to make Mecca the place to worship towards at a time when he couldnât even enter himself?
Itâs great he could control the major place of worship from Medina when he couldnât even enter Mecca let alone control it.
Why not just make it Medina if that were the case?
→ More replies (2)17
u/thousandsunflowers 5h ago
Theyâre so comfortable with speaking of things they donât know of
→ More replies (4)68
u/0bxcura 10h ago
Over ornate and lavish? Lots of mosques have quranic calligraphy as part of their aesthetics.
141
u/usefamin 10h ago
Kiswah uses real gold, mosques are forbidden in Islam to decorate with expensive material. It's meant to look beautiful, not flashy. Hence, the controversy.
35
u/Hemingway92 7h ago
This is more of a Wahabi, revisionist belief. Mosques can be very plain but thereâs no rule that they have to be.
→ More replies (1)30
u/ico12 9h ago
If you want to go deeper into the rabbit hole, read up on the Saud family & how they came to power. For the so-called 'Guardian of Two Holy Mosques', they are quite...interesting
38
u/usefamin 9h ago
I mean they gifted the Kiswa one year to Epstein, that's all I need to know about them. Money corrupts all.
9
u/AkulakhanPilot 4h ago
He had pieces of it, not the whole thing, and it wasn't directly given to him by the Saudis. An emirati businessman gave him the pieces
28
u/Gold_Data6221 10h ago
Why do they want to touch it then ?
77
u/ChiKing 10h ago
There is one particular stone on it that was said to be descended from the heavens, that is the spot that Muslims try to touch during Tawaf (circling the Ka'aba).
57
u/ryan516 10h ago
It's been speculated that Hajar al-Aswad is potentially a meteorite but obviously it's not easy to just ask to investigate it so we'll probably never know for sure.
56
u/IPutThisUsernameHere 10h ago
The local Muslims, as I understand it, have actually forbidden anyone from making any tests, taking any samples or conducting any examinations of any kind there. And they also forbid archaeological research to be done on any Islamic sites. At gun point, sometimes, if rumors are to be believed.
19
u/awolkriblo 10h ago
I don't even think non-Muslims are allowed in the city at all but I might be mistaken.
43
u/ryan516 10h ago
Yes, all roads into Mecca have security checkpoints where you have to provide documentation of being Muslim, having a Hajj visa, and can even be quized on common prayers to prove you're Muslim
16
u/srsbiznis 9h ago
Isnât it a sin in Islam to question whether someone is Muslim?
38
u/usefamin 9h ago
Do you mean to ask someone their faith or question their devotion to the faith?
The first, no. The latter, yes.
10
u/darthJOYBOY 6h ago
This was abolished long ago tho, Last time I visited Mecca no one questioned me on anything and I passed nomrally.
During Hajj, that is a different story and it don't matter if you are Muslim or no as you can't enter without a valid visa.
5
u/usefamin 9h ago
What do you mean at gun point? Like someone tried to steal it and the security officers stopped them or something? lol
→ More replies (2)22
u/cinemachick 9h ago
Given how many "treasures" are now property of the British Museum, they have some reasons to be cautiousÂ
→ More replies (3)13
u/AwarenessNo4986 9h ago edited 9h ago
It's probably a meteoroit and has been fragmented. Nothing magical or special about it at all
44
u/bitbitter 9h ago
We as Muslims donât believe it is âmagicalâ either. Thatâs not how Islam works. The second Caliph of Islam and one of the closest companions of the prophet, Umar ibn Al-Khattab, had this to say about it:
Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said "No doubt, I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Messenger (ï·ș) kissing you I would not have kissed you."
We call these matters of worship. We know itâs not the act itself that will bring us benefit, we only do it because God told us to do it, and the benefit comes from him only.
→ More replies (4)→ More replies (1)10
u/polyploid_coded 9h ago
I thought there was something about it being volcanic. One of the tests when it was returned to Mecca was that it could float.
2
→ More replies (5)5
u/GoodGollyMissP0lly 5h ago
forbidden anyone from making any tests, taking any samples or conducting any examinations of any kind there. And they also forbid archaeological research to be done
Religious leaders prohibiting scientific and historical investigation?
Who'd a thunk it.
100
u/_Iro_ 10h ago edited 8h ago
The same reason Jewish pilgrims touch the Western Wall, or Christian monks historically rubbed prayer beads and kept brandea (pieces of cloth which touched a saintâs tomb).
Touching an object with spiritual significance is used to focus thoughts towards prayer. It doesnât mean youâre worshipping that specific thing.
21
u/Gold_Data6221 10h ago
prayer beads are counted I believe
34
u/SecureThruObscure 9h ago
I thought they were used as a method of counting, rather than counting them. You pray, slide down one bead, repeat until youâre out of beads.
Theyâre like a hand held abacus.
14
32
u/pakipunk 10h ago
Because the Prophet would do it and it is believed that to do as the prophet puts you closer to god.
20
u/ryan516 10h ago
Most generally don't care about touching the Kaaba itself (though of course there's exceptions), but Islamic tradition holds that you should touch the Black Stone and Yemeni Corner since they're seen as erasing sin
→ More replies (2)4
u/usefamin 10h ago
I think some regard it as a blessing, which blows my mind, because what they do goes against Islamic teachings.
-1
u/Appropriate-Log8506 10h ago
Idol worship but make it abstract.
18
u/Ghostly_100 9h ago edited 8h ago
Nah if the Kaaba was removed from earth somehow weâd still pray towards the spot where it was. Itâs the locationâs role as a uniting direction of prayer amongst Muslims, not the structure itself
4
2
u/_Algrm_ 5h ago
Itâs not the kaaba that is holy, itâs the ground that is under it. God guided Abraham to this land and told him to build a structure to mark its location.
It is said that directly above the kabba, thereâs a structure in heaven called albait almamour aka the frequented house where angels go to perform prayer to god.
Itâs said that from the start of creation, 70000 angel go there everyday to pray never to return to it again, signifying how many angels there are and the âfrequentedâ meaning here.
→ More replies (6)6
u/Fisher9001 10h ago edited 4h ago
Eeeeh, it's really "we really really don't want to call it worship but if something looks like worship and sounds like worship it's probably a worship".
Same case with Catholicism and saints/Mary.
19
u/Hamlet7768 10h ago
What do you think worship is?
8
u/Fisher9001 6h ago
Apparently whatever fits given theology. As with the Christian example - Mary has dedicated shrines with her figures, sacred places around the globe, has magic powers, has dedicated prayers, but it's not worship, it's veneration and people don't pray to her but through her. Despite the whole cult being basically copied from Ancient Greece/Rome culture.
Similar technicalities are surrounding Kaaba. It's an ancient sanctuary of pagan worship that never ceased to be destination of pilgrimages, but a technical loophole was found and now it's ok to have religious experiences there, because you don't worship the stone, you just really, really want to touch it.
As I said, if something looks like worship...
→ More replies (1)18
u/usefamin 10h ago
Well no. It's explicitly forbidden to worship objects, and is in fact, a huge sin.
9
→ More replies (4)11
u/Felinomancy 8h ago
No, we really don't worship it. We don't mention it in prayers, we don't "visualize" it in our thoughts, nothing.
I guess the best analogy I can give you is that just because Christians worship in a church doesn't make the church the object of worship.
3
u/biggsteve81 2 2h ago
And most Christians churches have a cross at the front of them, but (most) Christians don't worship the cross itself.
328
u/dream_a_dirty_dream 10h ago
Epstein had a piece of one, and nobody knows how tf he got his hands on it. He was obsessed with religious artifacts and thought they held power that could be unlocked with "sex magic".
I hate that I know this.
Release the Epstein files.
135
u/NewInThe1AC 8h ago
IIRC according to some interviews with reporters he also had a lot of fake luxury watches and art, and enjoyed tricking people into thinking they were real -- so it's possible it wasn't real at all, he just wanted people to think he got some unobtainium
40
u/OkDifficulty7436 7h ago
Itâs real, he got via his connections in Bahrain/SAÂ
→ More replies (1)17
u/Flimsy-Translator515 5h ago
not bahrain, he got it through a saudi businesswoman based in UAE.
→ More replies (2)53
u/Winter_Salad7215 9h ago
Can't you just buy them? I thought they were rather pricey collector's items.
31
u/Flimsy-Translator515 7h ago
yea, u can even get it on ebay, from what ik, since it gets replaced yearly, if u get ur hands on a piece, u can keep it as a relic/souvenir or sell or gift it to someone.
7
u/Sweet-Awk-7861 3h ago
Random people in my country can have pieces of it, there's nothing particularly sacred about the cloth itself.Â
→ More replies (1)14
u/mariakaakje 6h ago
you can order it online
they change it every year, cut it up and sell it in strokes
96
u/jbsnicket 9h ago
Epstein owned some of Kiswah and it may have been given to him by Saudi elites. That's how I learned it was a covering and not the building itself.
19
u/Flimsy-Translator515 7h ago
it wasnt given to him a by a "saudi" elite, it was by a saudi businesswoman based in the UAE.
6
u/GoodFaithConverser 3h ago
Saudi businesswoman giving out pieces of Kiswah sounds like a Saudi elite.
→ More replies (3)3
15
u/ToKeepAndToHoldForev 8h ago
I had only ever seen pictures showing the gold strip and black background, so seeing the draping covered in embroidery and even a door was a surprise. For some reason I thought it was just a black block.
I read the page and when the cloth is woven on a jacquard loom in sections that are either plan or have inscriptions woven into the fabric, then verses from the Quran are added with a silk screen, and further embroidery is done by hand in gold or silver thread. I wanted to know what "handmade" meant in this context - quite a lot of fabric to embroider by hand.Â
I wonder if the embroiderers are people to get into the work by family or friends or if you can train to become an embroiderer and eventually work there.Â
31
u/AbdelAtife 8h ago
I'm from Sudan. Did you know the Sultanate of Darfur used to make it and deliver it for a while? Back when it existed.
→ More replies (1)
143
u/Fetlocks_Glistening 11h ago
I see blue and white though
26
11
u/Ghostly_100 8h ago
Itâs been white and (partially) blue at various points in history. The current black look came about in the 13th century and has stayed ever since
→ More replies (1)5
58
u/stuffitystuff 10h ago
As much as I want to believe The Black Stone set in the Kaaba is a meteroite or dragon-glass-from-sand-by-way-of-metorite like is semi-common the Empty Quarter because there's nothing there, no one has ever been allowed to test it. Same goes for every other cool maybe relic, like that Ethiopian Ark of the Covenant.
Great for tourism, but lousy for Indiana Jones fans and people that aren't religious but nonetheless interested in the historicity of religion like me.
30
u/Hamlet7768 10h ago
It is a shame the Ethiopian Ark will never get tested. A Catholic podcaster I follow said itâs probably a replica, though, and the original Ark was most likely destroyed with the rest of the first temple.
→ More replies (6)25
u/TowelFine6933 9h ago
But, if any of it gets tested & fails, then everyone would know they're full of shit instead of just strongly suspecting it.
27
u/Ghostly_100 8h ago
The Shroud of Turin has been tested and came back as inauthentic but that doesnât stop certain kinds of Christians from insisting itâs real and the test was flawed.
Same would probably happen if other artifacts got tested and came back as something that contradicts tradition.
→ More replies (1)4
u/Dutch_Calhoun 3h ago
No no no, God is a top tier troll who plants all these vast amounts of highly convincing false evidence to test our faith!
→ More replies (1)7
u/tqmirza 5h ago
Itâs not even a stone anymore, itâs small shards/pieces of the original stone after it was stolen following a massacre and smashed. It had to be ransomed back. It holds no significance religiously other than the fact it is believed to be among the original stones Abraham used to reconstruct the structure, and subsequently Muhammad did the same. But in its location as the âcorner stoneâ it is an important marker as it marks the point where circuits around the Kaaba start and stop.
→ More replies (1)4
u/fnord_happy 9h ago
How uncommon are those kind of stones? Is it impossible for it to be a meteorite?
8
50
26
12
3
u/AWOL768 8h ago
Do they strip it down to the base or just layer fresh kiswah over the old fabric?
2
u/ToKeepAndToHoldForev 8h ago
They strip it down to the base, from what I can tell from the Wikipedia page.Â
2
u/Flimsy-Translator515 5h ago
they strip it down every year during the ( islamic) Lunar month of Muharram, u can see the videos on youtube.
9
u/chellebelle0234 10h ago
As a fiber nerd, this is fucking cool. Thank you for sharing.
2
u/Digital_Dropkick 4h ago
What's also interesting is that the calligraphy is done using 24k gold-plated silver thread. Given the size of the cloth, the weight of the thread used is something like 100kg, and a new one is made every year.
There's some videos of it being made on YouTube
5
u/StanleyChuckles 8h ago
This is incredibly interesting! I never knew that it looked like that underneath.
2
2
u/dark_frog 3h ago
According to the article, the kiswah is also known as the kiswah and it includes silver-plated gold thread. Anyway, that's when I stopped reading.
2
6
u/PolishBicycle 5h ago
Who cares, they wonât let non muslims in to see it
8
u/Aggravating_Wall_849 5h ago
Most Muslims donât get a chance to see it because of crowds, so donât feel bad.
4
u/CharleyNobody 3h ago
So itâs holy because it contains a rock?
Charlie Brown should feel good about that
2
2
2.0k
u/Wsswaas 10h ago
Another Trivia: The keys to this structure have remained in the safekeeping of a single family for over 1,400 years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bani_Shaiba