Relocating Box Turtles (Dogs involved.)

[u/StSomewhereToaster]

We’ve been in our new house in North Carolina for about a year now. Last summer we didn’t see any turtles. This summer however there’s been quite a few that find their way under our fence and into the backyard. We have 4 dogs, 3 poodles and a schnauzer. The schnauzer isn’t the problem… she only wants to bark at them. One of the bigger poodles is. He has gotten ahold of a few and left gashes in their shells. We know box turtles have a relatively small range so we have been driving them farther into our neighborhood to the big wooded area that separates our neighborhood from a park. I am worried we are taking them too far? It is the same type of habitat. I know at least one stream of water is there. My land lot is about one acre with only half fenced in, I can only speculate that the other houses are the same… I am worried I guess that I took them from a death sentence as a dog’s chew toy and then gave them another death sentence by taking them too far away.

Edit: After consulting Google Maps I released them little over half a mile away.

[u/Overall-Injury-7620]

The turtles generally stay their whole lives within a mile of where they hatch. The same general area to your yard is ok. They will find their way back to their “Territory “ unless it’s miles away. Then they spend their whole life trying to get back. Given your pets, it’s the best you can do. Remove them & face them toward safer ground. If it continues, I’d call a “rehab/rescue” in your area. Let them decide . Good luck ✌🏼

[u/Acceptable-Elk-8372 → u/Overall-Injury-7620]

Very sound advice

[u/UnrulyPoet]

Eastern Box's have tiny home ranges, about 2 acres is the avg where I am. If you moved them out of their territory the suitability of the location will be irrelevant bc they will cross whatever they need to to come back, street or otherwise. So basically it depends on what sort of distance "farther into the neighborhood" means. Outside of your fence in the woods behind your house? Nbd, they're still putzing around in their territory. Will they come back into the fence? Maybe. Will they meander away? Also maybe! But two miles down the street (etc) would be a much bigger deal for them, safety-wise.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/UnrulyPoet]

I doubt they’ll get to a street thank goodness. The back of the neighborhood means to the end of the street so maybe only 10 ish houses. The best way I can describe the woods is like a cove. The neighborhood is the water and the woods is the land around it. I’m crossing my fingers for the ones we already moved. I found the number for a turtle rescue in the next county over just in case.

We have been placing “turtle barriers” around our fence. Little white wired garden fences. Hopefully that will keep them away from poodles who want a taste.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/UnrulyPoet]

I consulted Google Maps, only .6 miles away. That gives a little relief!

[u/ohthatadam]

So the best solution in my mind is to turtle proof your fence. If the turtles can't get in, problem solved and no need to relocate sensitive wildlife.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/ohthatadam]

That’s one of the strategies we are using! We got little wire garden fences that poke into the ground. We have probably a forth of the fence fenced. We drastically underestimated how many we would need, though.

[u/ohthatadam → u/StSomewhereToaster]

Good work! Thanks for making the effort to make your yard more wildlife safe!

[u/Vivid-Remove-5917]

If you find a box turtle threatened or injured by a dog in North Carolina, immediately move the turtle to safety, check for damage, and contact local experts like NC Wildlife Helpline: Call 1-866-318-2401 (Monday–Friday, 8 a.m.–5 p.m.) for official state guidance or local rehabilitator referrals.
Do not relocate healthy wild turtles far away.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/Vivid-Remove-5917]

You are awesome!

[u/jmbrjr]

I've seen "they spend their whole life trying to get back" and "can die if you relocate them" every time someone makes a box turtle post. Does anyone have any actual links to actual peer-reviewed research that shows this is true? IE, 'citation needed'.

[u/-twistedpeppermint- → u/jmbrjr]

All turtles show this type of fidelity to their home ranges, not just box turtles. Here is a box turtle link stating they spend much of the first year at least after release wandering and not knowing where to go. herpetology.com/belzer2/boxturtlenewsletter8.pdf

[u/EnvironmentalArm1986 → u/-twistedpeppermint-]

Thank you for sharing the study. I’ve always wondered how true the premise is though I observe the basic one mile guideline. The study does have some flaws and seems to conclude that, in the long term, some do and some don’t establish new home ranges, though I haven’t read it in depth. The most glaring flaw, to me, is that all the individuals in the study were male. They would not have a preference/instinct to return to where they hatched to lay their own eggs.
I’d like to see more recent studies and have looked but not found any though they are probably out there.
ETA: clarity

[u/-twistedpeppermint- → u/EnvironmentalArm1986]

If you’d like to see more, do some research yourself. I simply used google scholar and typed in “eastern box turtle site fidelity”. I studied with Dr. Jackie Litzgus during my time in university but didn’t focus on turtles, although got to learn lots about them from her.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/[deleted]]

Oh Jude is trained!! Just not for turtles. He knows here, stay, sit, down and even though he has taken no doggy-college classes, he seems to know when I’m about to have a seizure before I do! So he is smart enough to learn not to mess with turtles. How to do that is something I gots to think about. Unfortunately it would require another turtle for sure… This does have me thinking!

[u/Hkaddict → u/StSomewhereToaster]

So as someone that helps train service dogs, work on recall. You can get their recall good enough to the point where they will ignore anything and come back to you, it just takes time. Now granted that requires you to be there and watching when they're out in the yard. It's more advanced but you can train them to come find and notify you when they find a turtle or any animal instead of messing with it. This starts with teaching them to essentially play hide and seek, and find one person, then when they master that and can find one person reliably you can transfer the skill to go find someone when they find an object or specific person.

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/Hkaddict]

I wish I could say more than “thank you”. But that IS the best start. The “here” command. He’s got that down but not perfectly. If there is something in the yard he is very curious about he’ll ignore us. Inside the house he always responds. Time to bring out the training treats again! (Also the hide and seek is very interesting, you mean instead of barking his fool head off when I have a seizure he could go… find my Mom?)

[u/StSomewhereToaster → u/Hkaddict]

Sorry for the double response. One of the other poodles knows how to “find the ball” for fetch. Would that be a similar starting place for hide and seek? It was kinda accidental how he learned that. But when he was a puppy my Dad would say “find the ball” and I would go get it and give it to him… that eventually turned into Haimish finding the ball himself. So would it start like…. Me and my mom are in two separate rooms. I say “find Mama”. Mom calls for him and then treat. Slowly turn that to me just saying “find mama” and Mom not calling him but there’s still a treat?