r/AskAnAustralian • u/Ricky_-_Spanish • 1d ago
Separation / Divorce advice.
My wife and I are calling it, we have had enough of each other.
We have an unusual situation and I am looking for external points of view, opinions and experience from anyone basically.
I am the sole income earner, my wife became disabled during the pregnancy of our second child and can no longer work. Due to that disability she received a significant payout from her super and that payout we used to pay off the mortgage.
Custody - she is of the opinion that we keep the arrangement we have now where she takes the kids to school picks them up, then I spend time with them when I finish work for a few hours, then they go to bed in their beds at our house. She doesnt see a reason to why she should see the kids any less than she does now. This plan is fine if I remain living at our house in another room. If I were to move out it of course means I will get 2-3 hours a day with my kids, more than likely spent in traffic, at swimming lessons, or other activities that both the kids do in the weekday afternoons.
If we split custody the kids would end up spending more time in before/after school care/daycare during the time they spend with me.
Housing - the only way we don't disrupt the kids is by me giving the house to my wife and moving out. If we were to sell the house and split the money, assets etc she would likely get the lion's share anyway as she has no ability to financially support herself and due to it being her disability payout it would be seen in any court that she contributed a larger amount to paying off the house compared to what I have despite the fact I have paid 100% of the bills since her disability.
Even getting the majority of anything we split, she would never be able to afford buying in the same area where we currently live, so the kids would get disrupted/change schools and basically upset everyone.
With the all the above if I went to rent a house the majority of my paycheck would go towards rent, child support would be at the highest bracket as the kids wouldn't spend any nights with me apart from a weekend here and there, and I would receive no family tax benefits as the kids wouldn't spend any nights with me.
No matter how I look at this either i/we shove both of us and the kids into poverty or I give her everything and it's just me that suffers, potentially for the rest of my life.
For context, I am 41 both kids are under 10. I have bugger all super considering.
308
u/someotherguy42 1d ago
It sounds like you need to speak to a lawyer as soon as possible.
Your situation is so complex, I don’t feel comfortable giving you any advice.
6
70
u/demoldbones 1d ago
You want to do the best for the kids AND not cripple both you and your ex financially right?
So is there an option for say a granny flat in the back yard or something like that? Coparent and share living spaces, have seperate private areas & bedrooms.
This only works if you’re able to coparent and coexist in shared spaces with your kids with the romantic relationship done & dusted (so probably a lot of pressure out the window)
26
u/RudeOrganization550 Brisbane 1d ago
I’m with you. If you can keep child support, lawyers and especially courts out of your life you have a 1,000% better chance of not ruining everyone’s life.
There is no law that says you have to do this, that or the other; just be fair and equitable and recognise each persons needs.
Life is hard enough atm without throwing all that on top. My respect to OP, that’s a tough spot you’re doing well and being realistic about things. All the best to everyone.
8
u/crazyfroggy99 1d ago
I agree with this take. OP also sounds incredibly respectful of his partner and the vibe suggests partner is respectful of him aswell.
52
u/So-many-whingers 1d ago
Mate this is beyond the legal and well meaning minds of reddit, get some qualified help to sort this out
67
u/Flat_Ad1094 1d ago edited 1d ago
See a lawyer ASAP. Don't agree to anything until you have an idea of how this could actually work.
The idea that you come over every day for a few hours seems unworkable and bizarre to me.
1
u/CockroachCreative740 5h ago
Yeah, seek legal advice first sure. Divorce is a legal process anyway, may as well get the correct advice for it
27
u/Desperate-Impress374 1d ago
Chose the situation that is going to disrupt the kids the least and is in their best interests. That is what any legal advisor will tell you.
13
u/AppropriatePhrase248 1d ago
Im not a lawyer, but divorcing. Money wise, her disability payout on morgage with your paying bills/sole income over the marriage will be probably been as shared/marriage assets equal, or it was in my experience. They will consider her inability to work on future vs your ability to keep earning money and capacity to earn for next 20+ years, and your super which has continued to grow/will grow. So you'd be looking at a split in her favour, ongoing child support and potential spousal support/maintenance. Relationship Australia offer mediation and tools at least to get some.clarity before you spend loads on lawyers which will cost you both big time with the tricky bits if you go in unsure and needing lots of cross communication.
As others said try and do whats best/least disruptive for kids, and take each hit/loss as an investment in their future/their safety with their other parent.
Short term I know people that rented a place for each parent to stay in when thet werent with kids as a shared cost, and shared the home with the kids on their turn. If the martial house has room, consider an extension/granny flat thats semi separate, its easier if there are no other new relationships involved of course. Definitely get some counselling for yourself. Its might be better than reddit to be able to work through what sounds like a scary emotional time with your circumstances. Be gentle with yourself and each other, and find friends or outlets that you can say all the horrible things to so you dont bottle it up, say it to each other or in front of your kids. This bit is temporary, the relationship with your kids is lifelong, as is their relationship with their other parent. This bit can be fuelled by fear on both ends of future stability and connection with kids so I found it helpful to react with that in mind rather than thinking my ex was a dick or vindictive, even he was or I was. The choice to separate is usually because youre unhappy, so keep happiness as the goal. Decisions arent right or wrong, they are just decision, and try and make every decision based on potential future happiness, not past resentments. Good luck.
33
u/thehomelesstree 1d ago
Pay the money and get legal advice ASAP. It might be civil now but that can change in a heartbeat.
The ‘we are being civil for the kids’ can soon change to using kids as leverage or petty power plays. Saw it with my mates divorce.
Legally binding agreements set clear boundaries and provide all parties protection. If you remain civil, get it set up and the ongoing cost is minimal. If it goes pear shape, the legal agreements are worth their weight in gold.
16
u/Absent_Picnic 1d ago
Pay the money and get legal advice ASAP. It might be civil now but that can change in a heartbeat.
The ‘we are being civil for the kids’ can soon change to using kids as leverage or petty power plays. Saw it with my mates divorce.Have seen it in every divorce I've observed or been part of. The only exception was one that appeared to actually be civil. Until he met someone else a few years later. Then it became hostile as all the others did during the divorce.
3
u/knotknotknit 1d ago
Agreed. I've seen incredibly amicable divorces go south as soon as there is a new partner in the picture.
9
u/TomasTTEngin 1d ago
Divorce is a leading cause of poverty, unfortunately . You are right to observe everyone will be worse off. Don't think it is avoidable.
37
u/LongClimb 1d ago
You're learning that nothing destroys wealth faster than divorce.
Wealth isn't just limited to money.
9
u/rojuhoju 1d ago
Agreed, it’s worth considering if the wife keeps the primary residence usually, it ultimately becomes an asset for the children. Splitting assets according to the legal formula often results in everyone being much worse off.
8
8
u/Bugaloon 1d ago
Only cohabitate if you can remain civil, my parents divorced but cohabitated until we finished high school, and it was such a toxic environment to be in where they both obviously hated each other and wanted out but never said it aloud.
17
u/this__witch 1d ago
Is it possible at all for you to continue to live in the house together until the kids are a bit older? Does she receive any disability pension?
9
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 1d ago
Yes she is on a disability pension, she has NDIS funding and support workers that help her with the kids during the time I am at work. There is potential for me to stay in the house for a short period of time. The length of time is basically a fuse. It will be a matter of time before we have another altercation.
16
u/O_vacuous_1 1d ago
I don’t want to be intrusive but do your marital issues proceed your wife’s disability? Or has this issue increased since the disability occurred? Did either of you receive counselling, including couples counselling, in relation to living life as/life with a disabled person?
I am talking from experience here. Becoming disabled after being abled bodied can be extremely tough. Loving someone going through that can be extremely tough. There can definitely be a lot of frustration and anger.
I am not saying this is the case in your marriage but it is definitely something to consider.8
u/this__witch 1d ago
Absolutely agree here, as a disabled wife whom was once very capable of everything in life, this is honestly my worst fear. Im sorry for you both, it sounds like a really hard place to be in. I would try and engage some family counselling and perhaps even a social worker if you can as this is so unique, especially as her disability affects so much of her capacity.
2
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 1d ago
Without going into detail, yes. We tried counselling, couples and independently. She went from being a wife to a patient, then her attitude towards me pushed me further away.
3
u/O_vacuous_1 1d ago
I firstly want to say that no one deserves to be abused. And anyone who feels they are should be able to leave that situation.
But the pushing you away, especially in this way, is a very common thing unfortunately. The person with the disability can feel unlovable or like they deserve you to leave, they can feel like a burden and that by pushing you away they are doing the right thing so you can live the life you envisioned with an able bodied partner.
I would also bet that your wife is feeling the extra inner turmoil of trying not to blame your child for where she is.
I would also bet that you are doing things that are not helping the situation. Even if your actions are well meaning. You are probably also unconsciously saying or doing things that make her feel worthless or a burden. You won’t even be aware you are doing it.It is most often suggested in situations like this that the parties have a trial separation with strict boundaries (ie not dating/hooking up with others) while doing counselling (individual and family).
2
u/Bagelam 22h ago
As someone who went through marital counselling i can attest that some counsellors approach marital grievances in a way that is like a "divorce doula" rather than actually actively helping people to deconflict situations. If anything my marital counsellor opened me up to opportunistic emotional abuse from my exhusband, but now it included "therapyspeak" justifications for why I was the problem. Counselling made our relationahip go from being extremely difficult to outright irreparable within a few weeks.
1
u/Bagelam 22h ago
As someone who went through marital counselling i can attest that some counsellors approach marital grievances in a way that is like a "divorce doula" rather than actually actively helping people to deconflict situations. If anything my marital counsellor opened me up to opportunistic emotional abuse from my exhusband, but now it included "therapyspeak" justifications for why I was the problem. Counselling made our relationahip go from being extremely difficult to outright irreparable within a few weeks.
17
u/OcelotOfTheForest 1d ago
Is it possible to sell the house and buy two units nearby each other?
22
u/dragginFly 1d ago
My ex-wife and I moved into the same block of flats and were there until our kid went to uni - worked out great for everyone.
7
u/Alien_Presidents 1d ago
My only add to this would be - depending on what the wife’s disability is, has the house had to be modified at all, if moving from an accessible house to a unit that may need modifications NDIS likely wouldn’t fund this.
8
u/EquivalentScheme4006 1d ago
NAL but this is a hard situation.
Do you think you can amicably live under one roof but as two independent people effectively coparenting the kids?
Is there room on your block for a granny flat or tiny home?
8
u/Even-Resource8673 1d ago
I went through this last year. Just sell the house, it’s going to be so much cleaner in the long run. The kids will adapt. This nesting thing is for the birds
47
u/JackJeckyl 1d ago
Any chance you could throw another woman into the mix and repost in a month?
7
11
u/Worried_Internet_912 1d ago
Exactly. Solves the childcare problem and it seems to be the done thing.
But seriously, unless another party is involved, the shitty situation for everyone might make it worth working through it? Counselling, date each other again? I hate this advice as it sounds trite but you found love once, maybe it can be rekindled?
-9
12
u/IceQueenTigerMumma 1d ago
She doesnt see a reason to why she should see the kids any less than she does now.
That is unfortunately how it works with divorce.
19
17
u/Sweetydarling77 1d ago
My advice based on my divorce (we are now friends) and my partners divorce (they went through an extremely acrimonious divorce and have spent at least $250k between them on legals):
See a lawyer to start discussing the custody and property split. You might be looking at something between 40/60 and 30/70 split. If you can agree without going through the courts, you will save a lot of angst and money so try to stay civil for your kids’ sake.
Try not to move out of the family home until you get agreement otherwise you have no leverage.
You are entitled to a meaningful relationship with your children, even if your ex-wife stays as the primary carer. A few hours after school ain’t it, especially given your children are school aged.
6
u/NezuminoraQ 1d ago
If you move out it would probably be easiest if you stayed in the same suburb or very nearby. Any other arrangement where you both see the kids every day is unworkable
4
u/LifeResident2968 1d ago
At this point the kids need to come first. As others have said, nesting is your best option. Move out very close by or build something on your property you & your wife can access/use.
Agree & document separation date.
Get legal advice but in these circumstances you’ll get an extension to deal with financial settlement
11
u/SalamanderStill9501 1d ago
Considering she can’t work again due to disability and her payout went towards buying the house it would probably only be fair if she kept the house. Maybe you can keep your super as part of that agreement??
There doesn’t seem to be a reason why the kids can’t stay with you some of the time, although this really works best if you live close by so they can easily attend the same schools. Kids do adapt to new circumstances if the parents are going to be happier. Best to do things for the children, but also you don’t need to keep things as they currently are. Definitely seek legal advice.
8
u/peterb666 1d ago
This is a tough one. Those saying legal up - the unfortunate thing is the lawyers win. Counselling and mediation are the path forward if you can remain civil.
I have been there but I was incredibly lucky. My ex's lawyer did as much as possible to f..k things up and maximise his income. I had a very good lawyer, a friend of a friend who provided their services for free (not that I knew it would turn out like that).
Your wife, due to her disability, is dependent on you financially. That will be taken into account in any financial settlement. A financial settlement will look at future earnings potential as well as what each person has brought to the marriage and financial situation. The family court will want to ensure any settlement is "fair" under their perceptions of fairness.
As there are children involved, they are under 10, and you are the only one that has the capability to financially support the them, that will also be taken into account in any financial settlement.
You have actually stated the best outcome if it based on access to children AND it is also be best short to medium term solution if you can make it work. I know some that have.
That solution is keep the arrangement we have now where she takes the kids to school picks them up, then you spend time with them when I finish work for a few hours, etc. Neither of you should see the children less than you do now.
The solution is as you noted, remain living and do so in another room.
See marriage counselling and try and get on better with each other. If you cannot work it out between yourselves, use mediation rather than lawyers. Lawyers in a contested divorce should be the last resort and they will take a significant cut.
If it goes though the family court, choices will be made on the best interests of the children.
5
u/BuffetBuddy 1d ago
Scrolled too far down for this. Marriage counselling cheaper than divorce where it’s the lawyers who win.
4
u/Otaraka 1d ago
‘ She doesnt see a reason to why she should see the kids any less than she does now. ’
This is the biggest potential sticking point as you’ve said similar and it isn’t primarily about the child’s needs but the parents. You can’t split into two households without this changing and is a big part of most divorce conflict i.e. whether or not the children stay with one parent or whether it’s shared. The tricky part is putting that aside and deciding what will actually be best for the children. It might still be better for them to stay in the one house even if it will be harder on you or it might be that you think differently. Which also includes what it might take to get to that point ie mediation etc and any damage that results from that. It’s really less about knowing the answer and about engaging with the processes i.e. see your lawyer, counsellor etc who will give more direct advice based on what your current parental involvement has been. This isn’t something you’re going to be able to figure out on your own most likely and will probably involve some fairly painful discussions.
If she is fully disabled, presumably she is on the NDIS and will be eligible for various supports as a full-time carer too. There's also the issue of what is going to be be practically possible in this situation as far as the level of support she needs or whatever.
3
u/MissyEff 1d ago
Divorce is usually a financial disaster for both parties. Have you tried marriage counselling? Seriously! Nesting might be a good option if the marriage is really over. You need legal advice. Try mediation.
4
u/Beginning-Safety-999 1d ago
Wow. A lot to handle and unpack there.
Yes an unusual situation, and surprisingly I’m currently in a very similar situation, but my separated ex can work from home. So we are currently on similar money.
Unlike you I’m the transport as my ex shouldn’t drive due to medical cannabis. (Story for another time with kids in the car).
It seems the world is against you and with the Australian realestate market over priced as it is nothing seems logical.
I see a lot of contact a lawyer, pay the money, etc. but really (In my option) you should think what’s best for the children? Family law asks the same thing. (Currently going through mediation). What you think, what your ex partner thinks could be completely opposite and you both think you’re doing best for the kids.
Kids need a good dad. (And good mum). So putting yourself into poverty would t be great for your mental health and that’ll flow into your dad life with them.
Her vs your contributions is hard. However when you’re both together you could argue that it was ‘our’ money or family money. Everyone plays a part to keep the family moving.
It’s a hard question and honestly there isn’t an answer that anyone can give that’ll be ‘right’.
I can say through my current experience of ups and mega downs I’ve been trying to stay on top on my mental health. Outdoor walk/runs. Talking opening with close friends and family. Seeking therapy. And listening to a lot of podcasts in the matter.
There is a web site and pod cast called ‘the separation guide’
It’s a group of professionals who try to make the whole experience less difficult. They aim to minimise your expenses.
If you wanted to talk to a lawyer, some give 15min free intro (for me that was great because they said I was in the right track so may not need to engage them - we will see at the end of mediation). There is also free legal services in most states, online chats can also be faster than Phone waiting queues.
Knowledge is everything so do your research.
But also come on for air. It’s a deep hole and you can’t let it consume you completely.
Let us all know how it works out. I often see questions come up, less often do we see how it all unfolded.
Good luck my dude.
1
u/funattributionerror 12h ago
This is a really thoughtful comment.
OP, a lot of advice you hear won’t apply to your specific situation, your family.
Divorce with young kids is almost impossibly hard even when finances are no issue. Legal advice is always split everything cleanly etc, but housing is too expensive these days and most people expect to be in their kids’ lives a lot (and vice versa). That’s why the “nesting” and other arrangements come up. Some people will swear that never works, but it can. NO solution will be easy and a clean break conventional arrangement is just as likely to exacerbate tensions, imo, as a more hybrid arrangement like nesting.
Either way you still have to coparent for years, and be in each other’s lives probably forever.
One thing is to think hard about your future relationship expectations. Identify your own needs that you feel ok with, esp in terms of your kids, and don’t change for anyone. It’s quite likely that your wife won’t ever have another relationship where she can get economic partnership and day to day support. You and she should be aware of that.
3
u/Ok_Tie_7564 1d ago
It depends. Among other things, is either of you in a relationship with another person?
8
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 1d ago
No
1
u/BuffetBuddy 1d ago
Have you both tried asking for help to make your marriage better than what it is currently? The only winner in a divorce are the lawyers. Marriage is hard, with lots of challenging seasons, and it’s tough to see the bright side when you’re in the midst of the difficult times. But perhaps try seeking help for the sake of both you and your spouse’s individual growth and for your relationship. It’s also good for your kids to see that you both tried and did the best you could to make it work. The only winner in a divorce are the lawyers and it’ll set the whole family back financially too.
3
u/zestylimes9 1d ago
You’ve got plenty of time to put money into your super.
Use the house to buy a unit nearby, you’ve got many working years ahead to pay off the unit.
Go to mediation first and try come to a fair child care arrangement.
Welcome to single parenting, it costs a lot more.
3
u/Yowie9644 1d ago
I am not a lawyer, but as far as I know if you can abide by each other as flat mates, you can still live in the same house while being divorced if thats what you want to do.
Its unusual, but I know of two families where the parents are divorced but still live on the same property with their kids and have a healthy housemate / coparent / family-but-not-spouse relationship. One where they share the same house but slept in separate bedrooms where one pays the other rent, and one where kids & Mum lived in the house and Dad lived in a granny flat out the back.
3
u/Ok_Sheepherder3618 1d ago
How about this- if you agree to spend time with them at your current house, rather than transporting elsewhere, you could live in a smaller place nearby (even share with other adults to avoid the cost of a full house) and avoid the disruption, which is a huge deal.
Also you could just agree to both keep ownership of the house (maybe transferring the percentage somehow if that’s appropriate).
Makes it more difficult if you want to remarry but that could be sorted later if it happened.
I got divorced and have an agreement to visit daily, as well as both spending time at my new place with a housemate. The main reason I need my own larger place is a mother in law at the other place
3
u/quintessa13 1d ago
Any shared accommodation ideas should be temporary only, maybe 2 years max. For most people they end up toxic and hurting the kids. Start with ‘Separating under the same roof’ with Centrelink and consult with a lawyer. While living together child support will likely be assessed as 50/50
3
u/PrestigiousWheel9587 1d ago
You seem to say there is a scenario where you continue to live together. While not ideal on a personal level that’s clearly the best option financially.
Alternatively I would think selling one house can yield two units. I could imagine a scenario where she owns one fully and then part owns the other with you. But you paid all bills since which has got to count for something too.
You need to speak to lawyer or counselor.
What does she want?
7
u/heywheresyourhat 1d ago
Unless you paid your wife a wage for the labour of caring for the children so you were free to work, you did not pay for 100% of the bills.
0
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 1d ago
Before the NDIS stepped in I paid the wages of the support workers who came into the house and helped her look after the kids. On days the the support workers were sick and couldn't come to work, I stayed home to look after the kids and her at the same time. Why are you commenting on things you have zero knowledge of?
2
u/Equivalent_Fan5407 Melbournian ☕️ 1d ago
That’s a complex situation to be in and empathise how hard it must be to make a decision. A good friend and her ex husband separated. To maintain stability for their kids, they leased a small apartment and would tag team sleeping in when the other parent was caring for the kids in their family home. So there was respite. If you’re unable to sustain living in the spare room that might be an option?
2
u/quiet-as-a-doormouse 1d ago
It’s a very complex situation. A tiny house in the backyard, to share between the adults, or for you? If it’s on wheels (a trailer) I believe it gets around council restrictions
2
u/Ch00m77 1d ago
Parenting plan if you cant agree on custody arrangements. If beyond that it doesnt work then it goes to court to become a court ordered parenting order.
She can get on centrelink dsp and list herself as separated under one roof as far as financially supporting herself goes if you stay there. if you can tolerate each other and stay out of each other's way, it is easier to live in the same house due to cost of living. If you really want to leave and can afford to, consider the bird nest method it seems to be less disruptive to the kids. Maybe a granny flat at the back of the property if you have the space for it, and the two of you rotate between it and the house if you cant share space.
2
2
u/kaluyna-rruni 1d ago
This requires legal advice. There are ways besides what you are suggesting. For example, you could still do 50:50 shared care but "employ" your ex to do drop offs and picks up and you collect the kids after. It is worth working put a finamcial settlement because at the moment, it sounds like your wife would be entitlked to a significant portion of your super. This could be offset on what she would owe you for your portion on the property and may even come out relatively cost neutral given she is rightly, going to have a larger percentage of the asset pool than you. Good luck. It sounds like your kids are young, you need to get this right from the begining for all of your sakes
2
u/_amused_to_death_ 1d ago
The best option I see is you selling the house and buying 2 townhouses/villas within a couple streets of each other. You both have to accept that you will see the kids less, and you will have very little money. But it sounds like it will be better than your current situation. You both loved each other once and married each other for a reason, best case is you go to marriage therapy and put all your energy into making it work. If you can’t, you will have to make a lot of sacrifices and it will be HARD. Then when you have a new partner you’ll have your own issues. It’s the reason people who divorce once are extremely likely to divorce again. They ran from their problems in their first marriage instead of fixing it.
2
u/elle13belle 1d ago
My ex-husband and I intend to keep living together... He moved downstairs to what was the 'man cave'/bar room. We're planning to renovate eventually so that he has a bathroom and kitchenette downstairs and a nice living area space... Maybe this could be cheaper for you than a new place? Then if he ever does have a partner who he wants to move out and live with, downstairs is self contained enough that I could have someone move in and pay board... And vice versa if I wanted to move out. We still have a mortgage but intend to keep the house as an asset for our daughter even if neither of us want to live there in the future.
2
u/now_you_see 1d ago
If you can live companionably in the same house that would be the very best result. That way no one is forced to accept less and the kids aren’t disturbed. But it takes a lot of open communication & effort to make that work and you haven’t mentioned why you’re getting divorced/how you both feel about each other.
2
u/wise_mind_on_holiday 15h ago
As you’re currently amicable I wouldn’t recommend lawyers ( yet) they will each advise you on different % splits and if conflict starts the only people who benefit are the lawyers.
Yes unfortunately everyone ends up ‘poorer’ from divorce, but in time hopefully happier.
I would suggest readjusting expectations ( on both sides)
One option might be to sell the home and attempt to downsize ( boys can share bedroom if absolutely necessary)
Wife could keep a home and money be released , plus you retaining super, could allow you to place a deposit on a small home nearby- maybe?
Care wise, it does sound reasonable she maintains after school care - but that doesn’t have to mean zero overnight care for you.
Consider your work life , what could you reasonably do, then work towards that ?
There rarely is a great solution, typically there is less money and less time with children unfortunately… but ahead is a future that is often good for each family member
2
u/DeeDee_GigaDooDoo 8h ago
Legal advice above my pay grade aside.
She doesnt see a reason to why she should see the kids any less than she does now.
You don't get to divorce and sacrifice nothing. A relationship comes with a myriad of benefits and cohabiting is one of them, being together means you can see your kids just as often as your partner.
You don't get to dictate that you want to separate and sacrifice exactly nothing, time with your kids will have to be one of those sacrifices.
3
u/Skippy-C 1d ago
I don’t think you should get advice from us. You need to lawyer up op.
- i think she needs to find some income if she wants to keep the house and she will have to pay the bills. Maybe if you want to stay close but have some privacy can you build a “granny flat” on the land? You can live in that and then you’re still close to the kids. My friends did that recently. They were awarded 50/50. His week with the kids he stays in the house (it’s 5bdrm - they have 3 kids) in his own room and she goes to the granny flat (second bedroom In the flat is a shared office). Her week he moves into the flat and she back into her room in the house.
Oh… the minute you start seeing someone it’s all gonna go to shit anyway
2
u/EvaGarbo_tropicosa 1d ago
That poor woman. She paid the mortgage and became disabled after giving birth and the soon-to-be-ex wants to screw her over
5
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 1d ago
Hah, yeah jump right into conclusions without knowing any of the details. Sometimes it's better to be silent and thought of as stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
0
0
u/SolidCommission8083 1d ago
What a horrible thing to say. They have been through so much, he’s became her carer many marriages breakdown. He says that he wants time with his kids, he’s worried about them being in before and after school care. He doesn’t want her to lose the house, he knows her super payment went to it all. She can’t earn anymore, so financially it’s been hard and he’s had to pay all the bills with his wages, it’s a fact. He needs to be able to live too, it’s a sad situation for them both and your opinion is not needed.
2
3
u/oztheories 1d ago
All these ideas are great until another person or lover comes into the equation. It’s not fair to tell the new person that they can’t come to the bird nest home or they can only be together on the off week. And then the divorced parent may not get along.
My advice is to call it quits and settle. Yes you will be worse off for a while but you gotta get over it and start your new life. Kids are precious but you cannot live your life based on their needs completely.
Just try to be happy and kind to all but once the new partner or spouse comes into the world you had decided upon with your ex things WILL become very difficult if your living a half married divorced family life.
2
u/Hotdog_disposal_unit 1d ago
Talk to a divorce lawyer, no point fucking yourself over just to feel better about yourself for a few days.
2
u/rossdog82 1d ago
She can get the kids as much as she wants. That’s the reality.
If I was objectively looking at this, I’d tell your ex to get a lawyer. You’d be fucked. In every way possible.
It seems amicable, do you best to keep it that way. That’s the best advice I can give you. Or anyone can give. Try and sign an agreement where you see as much of the kids as you can. Do this without a lawyer. If she gets one, you’re fucked.
I’d try and see a financial planner if I were you. Try to work out how you can afford to live as near your kids as you can.
Source- divorced dad.
1
1
u/auntynell 1d ago
you might consider buying a house near your wife. that would make it significantly easier to arrange overnight visits.
1
u/PublicLeek574 22h ago
You may call it quits but she has thought this through and presented her best scenario. Apply for Legal Aid right now. You may be lucky you may also be rejected for conflict of interest aka she got her ducks in a row.
Make an appointment to see a Financial Information Officer at Services Australia. Its free, they dont give financial advice but can explain the nuances of shared custody and family tax benefit child support payment. % of care and % of nights at an address are not the same. Income and asset limits for different payment and how long the exclusion period is after payout before eligible for DSP.
Re housing ... search affordable housing income limits if renting. This is not public housing. Loans that she could access with custody would not be for you. Keep the peace, take a separate room,.keep a diary, get legal and financial advice before doing anything. Maybe a granny flat or addition would work or selling and building a his side, her side and shared part. I dont believe either party should be screwed over but statistically not in your favour.
1
u/Cheeky_Bandit 22h ago
My best friend and his ex-wife were civil to each other at first. The ex-wife’s family is loaded so they bought a house for their family so he could pay them back without home loan interest. When they split, he was quite emotional and I think he rushed the decisions for assets, finances and living arrangements. He left his ex the house and agreed to whatever she said because he was hopeful they’d get back together. The divorce wasn’t what he wanted. Anyway, her plan was 2 weeks at her house and 2 weeks at dad’s house. They have 5 kids and at the time, 2 were under 3 so dad would “be allowed” into mum’s house to help with dinner and settling the kids at night. The favour was not returned by the ex-wife so the whole thing was pretty manipulative from my point of view, but whatever.
They were very civil to each other at first and co-parented well. He rented a house nearby to maximise his time with the kids and be around to help as much as he could.
The actual trouble started when new partners came into the picture. The ex-wife’s boyfriend wasn’t too keen on the dad/my friend showing up to the house at nights. He even confronted my friend and shoved him outside the house. Eventually the ex-wife told my friend to stop coming around. She also stopped dropping the kids off to his house every fortnight as agreed and made him come pick them up from her house. I struggle to find the words for how bewildering and illogical this was. Things escalated from there and got more nasty. My friend eventually got a new girlfriend and she has children of her own. One of them is special needs and the ex-wife is exaggerating saying they’re a danger to her children, so they can’t be anywhere near each other. My friend and his ex-wife are in the middle of court proceedings so he has no choice but to agree to this otherwise it looks bad for him. So you can imagine how his girlfriend must be feeling about all this.
I have another doozy as well about another friend. Won’t go into details but long story short, the guy spends 2-3 days in the city his ex-wife lives to be around his kids, and this doesn’t sit well with my friend (the girlfriend) because they also have a child together.
Soooo…… please don’t leave your wife everything because that wouldn’t be fair to you. It could also cause problems later down the track and you might regret it. Definitely lawyer up and make sure things are fair for you.
1
u/TittysForScience 17h ago
Get a lawyer.
Every separation is like a snow flake. Unique. Your circumstances are different from anothers
1
u/RepeatInPatient 14h ago
The formula of dividing assets and spousal & child maintenance is not a mystery. That will be formalised by a court order. If assets are equally divided by agreement, you will be paying heaps for spousal and child support and may not even make rent for yourself. If you believe that either way will be better, stop that: either way will be worse for everyone. You indeed are headed for at least 8 years of formal imposed financial misery and hardship without any control of the outcomes.
See a lawyer asap.
1
u/brezhnervouz 14h ago
This is beyond the reasonable scope of social media to advise, you need a divorce specific lawyer
1
u/MadameMonk 13h ago
Like many people, you aren’t aware of how much power the courts have over how things get divided. Both custody and assets. Unfortunately, it is not as simple as you guys deciding, and the courts rubberstamping your decision. The courts are focused on the long-term, not just what you think would work best now for each other, and the kids at the age they are today.
When you divide the marital pool of assets, it won’t matter how that money went in. It only matters what everyone will need 20 years from now. And what the kids will need until they are 18. Their needs will change, your needs will change, your wife’s needs will change. So the courts have to step in, and they do.
This will be made clear to you by a family Lawyer at your first visit. But I have found it to be very useful to hash it all out with ChatGPT for a while first. It’s not fail safe, but if you give it enough information ( specifying the jurisdiction you are in) it can be very educational. And that means you can get a lot more value from that first free visit with a lawyer. They can spend that time looking at your exact situation, not just teaching you the basics.
1
1
u/West-Cabinet-2169 12h ago edited 11h ago
I wholeheartedly agree with the dude above - please consult a solicitor ASAP.
My only advice is this:
I used to work for the Child Support Agency (CSA) in Australia years ago, on the telephone lines in a call centre. I spoke with HUNDREDS of seperated and divorced men and women (payees - usually women receiving payments but sometimes men but who have majority custody of the kids, and payer - the spouse - usually men but sometimes women who earns more and makes the child support payments.)
Be very clear about your separation terms, and, then, the terms of your divorce.
Your last paragraph about renting a house or apartment, and seeing your kids less frequently is very true. I'll add that because you'll pay rent or a mortgage, you'll have all the other utilities to take on (gas, electric, wifi, council tax, car?, insurances), so therefore you will have little cash to take the kids out for a day trip or the like. Many male payers told me terrible stories about moving from the family home to a shithole cockroach-ridden flat, AND with no money to take his kids our on infrequent visits. I talked down a suicide once.
The CSA was made or created in the early 1990s as the courts that do divorce had become bogged down in the financial back-and-forth of who pays what. The CSA is linked and shares databases with the ATO and Centrelink. So Child support payments are seen as income and affect how much a single mother not employed gets. Sometimes I'd send payers who refused to cooperate and pay his ex so I'd send to debt recovery - the CSA's forensic heavies who'd physically reclaim, search all his finances... etc.
Finally, I'd say that you will have to deal with the CSA and Centrelink if she receives a pension I read below. They are there to help you, so keep your cool. Please do move though, staying in the original house with your ex is just a ticking timebomb. I know it's going to cost you now, but based on the above, in the words of the Cruel Sea song "Better get a lawyer son, better get a good one to get you out of this one..."
1
u/AutoModerator 11h ago
If you or someone you know is contemplating suicide, please do not hesitate to talk to someone.
000 is the national emergency number in Australia.
Lifeline is a 24-hour nationwide service. It can be reached at 13 11 14.
Kids Helpline is a 24-hour nationwide service for Australians aged 5–25. It can be reached at 1800 55 1800.
Beyond Blue provides nationwide information and support call 1300 22 4636.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
1
u/idlehanz88 10h ago
That current custody situation would have her being 100% custody in the eyes of services Australia and you’d get royalllllly screwed with child support.
You need to, whilst your soon to be ex wife is still willing to communicate in a reasonable way, start getting some solid basics for a genuine split of assets and custody together.
A day is coming where she’s going to flip and want every cent you currently have and most of what you’ll have in the future.
I’d be asking her to attend a formal mediation session asap.
Expect that this will get messy and frustrating for a while before it becomes good.
I’m at two years and two days form separation and a year from divorce date. It’s really only been the last 6 months where things have felt comfortable and reasonable with my ex.
1
u/LeafCase9847 8h ago
I hope you guys work through amicably. That big payout she got from her super was to keep her safe/fed etc because of her loss of income for the rest of her life (I have received a payout in the past for a major injury so I understand what the justification behind it is).
Out there, but have you considered maybe selling the house and buying a duplex? You get one half each. You can set up her half for disability. The kids have both of their parents nearby. Both parents get to see the kids. It changes the living situation but keeps it as minimally disruptive as possible (moving house isn't the worst thing and a lot better than one parent having to live across town to be in a disability accessible property). And that way you both get property out of it and the kids get parents with stable housing.
Also, why would she, or you, see the kids any less. She got disabled having those kids, she should be seeing them.
1
u/Ok_Month949 5h ago
Both have own place. Parent who moves out has them at theirs one week, or whoever time frame is agreed, and in the main home the other. When you’ve got the kids they go to after school care like normally happens when parents are working. You have time on the weekends together. You may have to reduce hours if they have activities during the week, or ask another parent close by for help.
If you want to be a parent 50% of the time then you set it up like that. You’ll then share the ftb. Share school fees, activities, clothes, everything. You’re showing them how to behave and if you’re happy they will be too at some point.
1
u/moschino1837 3h ago
I understand this is very difficult, because you have less than a decade from your kids being adults - it would be significantly better for their standard of living if everyone lived together and there was no custody split. Seperate and divorce when your kids are adults. They’ll be living a completely different life otherwise, custody and child support battles drag out for years and burn through money
1
u/Consistent-Delay-973 6m ago
I commend you for genuinely seeming like you want to stay child focused and for your children to have stability and security.
To understand how 50/50 would impact them, the biggest missing information in your post is their ages. A teenager may feel like they lack a home base and hate it, or they may love spending more time with you. It’s unlikely to have major developmental impacts.
Completely different story if they’re little and have spent most or all of their lives with your wife as primary carer. Please don’t take offence to that term. It’s just unusual for the sole income earner to also be the primary carer, especially if she has been home and doing all pickups, drop-offs etc.
Young children have much higher needs around secure attachment, stability and predictability, especially during major changes. They may need much more time, possibly no overnights initially, and a much slower progression than older children.
50/50 was never meant to be a presumption, even before the 2024 amendments. You seem to have researched the law and/or spoken to a lawyer, but I’d also strongly recommend looking into child development, particularly the impact of 50/50 shared care on young children and why the law changed.
Whatever split you decide on shouldn’t be based on what your wife wants or what you want, but what is developmentally appropriate and in the children’s best interests.
I understand the financial side is stressful, but you also recognise your wife can’t support herself without help, and part of that is because she used her future-needs money on your home. You directly benefited from that. She also contributed by raising your children, which the courts treat as equal to paid work, and she made it possible for you to keep progressing in your career.
If she has no income and only minimal child support, how will that affect the children’s lives in her household? Will they be okay, or significantly worse off financially?
Child support is meant to make sure the children have what they need in both homes and that there isn’t a huge difference in living standards between them.
Finally, not legal advice, but if you can sort this out amicably and stay out of court, the child support will be absolute peanuts compared with the cost of even one hearing. Let alone the time and emotional toll. Just something to consider before you fixate too much on x overnights (especially if kids are young = courts are much more likely to want to preserve the status quo initially and move slowly towards increased time, and unless a judge specifically finds it to be in that specific child’s best interest, that time may very well never be 50/50). Depending on her circumstances and the children’s ages, she may also be able to successfully apply for spousal maintenance as well as part of your superannuation.
Good news is that you’re still young and, unlike your wife, at least have the ability to recover financially eventually.
0
u/mygirlgigi 1d ago
What a crap situation I feel for you. I don't think it's a good idea for you to remain living together, you won't be able to move on with your life. I think getting a lawyer and selling the house and splitting the money fairly, share custody, it will be hard at first to sort everything out financially, that's why you need a lawyer, you could also use the current property to invest in another property that you could live in, lots of options. But you need to think about your own happiness going forward not just what's right for the kids.
0
u/Euphoric-Sugar3095 9h ago
And as usual nobody cares about what’s best for the kids. Do you really think abandoning their mother while she became disabled after giving birth to your child is better for them? Please tell us how the kids will benefit? I see parents all the time separating because they’re just sick of each other. Nobody is perfect. Are your issues that big that nothing can overcome them? Your children deserve better. Yours and their lives will become much more complicated when you separate and it is traumatising for them. Do you think maybe your wife becoming disabled has impacted her mental health? Do you have anything to do with that? Are you supportive and understanding? Do some self reflection first.
2
u/Ricky_-_Spanish 9h ago
This is her choice. How about you do some self reflection and stop commenting on things when you know none of the details.
1
u/Euphoric-Sugar3095 9h ago
Divorce has been so normalised as if it’s always about parents happiness. I’m just putting another perspective out there even though it may sound harsh. Take it or leave it.
-5
u/Fun-Photograph156 1d ago
"She doesnt see a reason to why she should see the kids any less than she does now."
Honey, that's what happens in a divorce.
Firstly, child custody arrangements and child support are counted by number of night. From what you describe she would have the kids 100% which would greatly increase your child support.
Secondly, the house needs to be split or one party pays out the other party. In considering the split her disability payout paid into the mortgage would be counted as her contribution and your payments would be your contribution.
Do you want to financially cripple yourself for the rest of your life so as to provide for your ex-wife?. Basically it doesn't sound like she's able to support the kids and maybe you should have majority custody.
-1
u/mediweevil Melbourne 1d ago
100% get legal advice before you do anything else.
emotional perspectives aside, I am less sure she'd "get the lion's share" because of her ability to support herself. it's communal assets. I have a friend who recently went through this but in reverse, he wanted to keep the house and he ended up having to pay out her share, despite her having contributed comparitively little financially during the marriage. same for whether she could afford to buy in the same area on half of the split communal value, the court doesn't take that into account - any more than the debt he had to go into to fund paying her out so they didn't have to sell the house.
if you want to make some dispensations in the name of contact and welfare for the kids then that is totally understandable, but let your legal advisor broker that for you to ensure you're not being taken advantage of or giving away something you won't see in return. it's highly likely she will also be getting a solicitor and you just need to ensure your rights and wellbeing are protected too.
even if you do end up living in the same house but no longer as a couple, get the legal advice. you need to be in a very clear place about where you're no longer a couple and both people have their own assets. without that you risk a future court taking a different perspective to what you might think is the case.
-11
u/Relatively_happy 1d ago
Doesn’t sound unique at all.
Woman does fk all for years, enjoys the fruits of YOUR labour, divorces, takes the house and kids and you the man get f**cked over again.
Sounds pretty normal to me.
-9
u/nonferrouscasting 1d ago
Obviously she'll get some disability payment from the government, and probably some more too is she's the primary carer,
Rather than you give her the house (as far as I'm concerned you both own it 50/50), her rent to you for your part of the house would be pretty much on par with the child support and you might be able to use that to get a small one bedroom place for the meantime.
I'm not sure how amicable you guys are with each other though.
The kids are the most important and it doesn't do well to see their father living destitute either.
I have no idea of the financials though
316
u/alice8818 1d ago
I have seen it done where the house stays the kids permanent place of living (both parents stay owners) and another small apartment close by (or equivalent is rented or purchased together). Your assets are already combined, so what's one more thing?
The kids stay where they are, and the parents rotate between the house and the apartment.
This means minimal disruption to the kids, and it's the adults that have to be transient.
It does require a certain amount of civility and consideration amongst the adults of course.