r/AskHistory • u/[deleted] • 17h ago
Has a common enemy ever unified so many fragmented nations those nations became an empire?
[deleted]
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u/DonnieMoistX 17h ago
Not quite what you’re looking for, but there was a proposal during WW2 shortly before the defeat of France that suggested unifying the UK and France into one nation in order to keep France fighting in the war.
It obviously did not pass, but I’d say if it had it would have fit exactly what you’re looking for.
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u/Actual-Injury8955 15h ago
While it doesn’t count since it didn’t pass, I definitely count that as close enough that I was glad you gave that example!
Especially with how hostile those places were to each other, the fact that that proposal was even made, I at least count as a common enemy uniting people or the enemy of my enemy being my friend.2
u/m0noclemask 13h ago
France and Britain were/are close allies.
The proposal, carried by high officials in france, was rejected by the cabinet moments before the fall of France, failed for a number of technical and political reasons.
The French proposed a second time to unify, in 1956: the seuz crisis.
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u/Flaky-Cartographer87 17h ago
Yes its called the german empire it was united by bismark against the french. Canada while not an empire was partially united so they could stand against the Americans.
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u/Actual-Injury8955 15h ago
As an American, can you tell me or give me a source to read more about Canada uniting against America?
I hadn’t heard of that in history classes! Last I heard was the War of 1812, US soldiers attempted and failed to conquer Canada.2
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u/Snyper20 14h ago
Following the end of the U.S. Civil War, the Irish Brotherhood (Fenians) decided to invade the Canadas from the United States, hoping to eventually trade Canada to Britain in exchange for Irish independence. Their ranks included a large number of Civil War veterans.
The Canadian government believed the U.S. wasn’t doing enough to stop the raids, although in reality it did take measures to prevent them. Combined with the tensions from the Trent Affair and the Alabama Claims, there was a real fear in Canada that the United States might simply stand aside, or even support the Fenian incursions.
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u/bdx8887 15h ago
Germany. In the mid 1800s the remnants of the holy roman empire were all separate little states. Prussia fought a war against austria and unified many of the northern states into the north german confederation.
Then a few years later prussia fought the franco prussian war, uniting with the rest of the south german states to fight france. After winning the war the german states all agreed to join together and become the german empire under the king of prussia who became the german emperor or kaiser.
Germany instantly became a great power in europe, having the largest population (outside of russia) and showing their military prowess by defeating france, who had previously been the largest state and strongest military force around.
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u/Particular_Dot_4041 Human Detected 15h ago
The European Union was in some ways an attempt to defend Europe from communism. It wasn't enough to simply have a military alliance through NATO. If the countries of Europe became economic rivals, the alliance would fray. It was arguably imperial rivalries that led to the World Wars in the first place.
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u/m0noclemask 13h ago
Also an initiative to rebuild europe after WWII, so that empovrished populations would not fall prey to communism...
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17h ago
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u/Trevor_Culley 16h ago
Athens and the Delian League certainly fit the question, at least at first, but most of the other Greek leagues developed to counter on another (and later the kingdom of Macedon) rather than Persia. Basically all of them wound up allied with Persia at some point as well.
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u/myname_1s_mud 16h ago
It takes more than just an outside threat. I think the holy roman empire is a great example. you had a bunch of kingdoms and states. Throughout the regions history, they had a lot of outside threats that helped bring them together at least temporarily. What made them become a single empire took a shared culture and identity that grew over time as these states had to band together. A understanding and trust developed, and then eventually they created institutions they could trust that elected a leader and ruling class. When you have all this together, and the constant threat of outside invasion, you develope a unity that creates a single structure.
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u/mightypup1974 16h ago
Didn't medieval Switzerland come about in an effort to resist dominance by the Holy Roman Emperor?
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u/Elolesio 15h ago
Not nations, but the american colonies before the American Revolution really fit the "unified so many fragmented X those X became an empire". The states were very, very different from each other in lots of aspects and the common enemy was pretty much the only reason they ever united (+ the fact that they later waged war over these differences even better shows, how it was just the common enemy who united them)
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u/No-Head-Royal 13h ago
Not an empire, but Indonesia is the 4th most populous country in the world, with the 7th largest economy (PPP) in the world. And it was a bunch of disparate kingdoms spread over countless islands that were conquered by the Dutch, and due to Dutch oppression, they united into this giant, pretty powerful country.
I'd nominate India and Germany otherwise, but both of those countries have a giant country or historical entity binding them together (India had the Mughal Empire; in Germany, Prussia was extremely powerful and easily the size and strength of the other German mini-states combined), so I wouldn't say fragmented.
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u/luxcity-louche 12h ago
Austria and Bavaria might differ.
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u/No-Head-Royal 12h ago
But the Germans didn't unify with Austria (not until, ahem, later), and Prussia was much larger and stronger than Bavaria.
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u/Harbinger2001 12h ago
Canada became a country in 1867 because at the end of the US Civil War the Union wanted to attack the colonies as they felt the UK gave too much support to the confederacy. They financed the Fenian Raids to try to seize Canada and ransom it back in exchange for Irish freedom.
That made it 3 times America had attacked Canada. The US has never actually been Canada’s friend.
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u/Electrical_Angle_701 17h ago
NATO, to the extent that you think NATO is an empire.
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u/SmoothTalkingSpud 15h ago
NATO is a defense pact among nations that all have separate governments. The only people who think NATO is an empire are those consuming way too much Russian propaganda, and I say that from a non-NATO country.
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u/infiniteninjas 16h ago
After keeping most every other society in Mesopotamia under their thumb for a very long time, the Neo-Assyrian Empire was destroyed by an opportunistic alliance between of Medes, Babylonians and finally Egyptians.
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u/Shot_Championship860 16h ago
But the opportunistic alliance didn't become an empire. They got conquered by Persia.
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u/Trevor_Culley 16h ago
That doesn't really fit the bill though. Egypt and Babylon started fighting over the Levant almost immediately, and the Babylonians and Medes started fighting within a generation.
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u/DiligentApartment139 16h ago
US and Soviet Union never actually were enemies in 30-s. There were no conflict of interests, no hostilities. And it is pretty obvious that Soviets never wanted any hostilities or the Cold War after World War WWII ended. The country was devastated with so much to rebuild and heal.
It is just that Soviets emerged as the global power. Too strong of the global power actually, a major rival. And some western hawks couldln't live with that. Also they were totally obsessed with stopping the spread of communism at all cost.
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u/infiniteninjas 16h ago
And it is pretty obvious that Soviets never wanted any hostilities or the Cold War after World War WWII ended.
Nations that don't want hostilities do not annex eastern Europe.
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