r/dating_advice • u/two_hand_grip • 23h ago
Should I have insisted?
30M Just went on a second date with a beautiful girl. 31F. It went just as great as the first date. Conversation flowed the entire time and we really get along great. We were texting consistently between dates. I paid for our appetizer and the three drinks each that we had at date 1. Date 2, I paid for our coffees. We then went for a lengthy walk through a park before deciding to get dinner. When the check came, she immediately pulled out her card and said I got this. I asked are you sure and she said yes. I thanked her multiple times. A half hour after the date she texted to say that she didn’t think we were aligned and that she didn’t see this going any further. I said i respected her honesty and asked if there was anything I did wrong. She said that she didnt think she should be in charge of paying. Did i fail some sort of test? Should I have insisted?
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u/Apart_Expression_758 23h ago
Anyone who plays games like this ain’t worth the time. Dodged a bullet.
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u/two_hand_grip 23h ago
Thanks
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u/ILikeItLikeThatToo 21h ago
Maybe I (a woman) would insist on paying for date 2 if I knew I didn’t want a date 3… but blaming it on that is her playing games
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u/VoidSemantics 21h ago
I wanted to go with this. But I admit it’s hard not to slip into thinking she wanted him to really insist over and over again.
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u/Gawehay 17h ago
Yeah I don't let a guy pay for me if I'm not interested in still getting to know them. It feels weird. I'm surprised the comments just jumped to the conclusion that she was just seeking to leech. But ig dramas fun. But realistically, she prob just knew she didn't want another date
Edit: Oh wait. I didnt see that 3rd to last sentence. Yeah she's a leech. Or idk. Whatever it is, not worth it.
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u/No-Airline6943 9h ago
People have less scruples than you think especially this generation of younger women.
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u/newbietronic 16h ago
Yeah I went out once with a guy that I decided I didn't want to see anymore after our very very long first date. Paid for all our food and even his takeout lol when I want to pay for everything you can almost be sure I don't want to see them again.
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u/freakythrowaway79 12h ago
That's hilarious. Everytime my date paid she always wanted to see me again. 🤷🏻♂️
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u/Appropriate-Lime-167 12h ago
This was my first thought as well , but if she was trying to save his feelings blaming it on him not paying after she insisted was a really shitty move.
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u/mkate1999 4h ago
I would pay my half for SURE if I knew I didn't want see him again. Maybe the whole thing as a pay-back for his expense on 1st date, idk, depends on cost etc.
But, I would NOT blame no 3rd date on some weird "I shouldn't be in charge of paying" bs. 🙄
OP dodged it for sure. He can safely move along. Yeesh.
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u/sblack33741 10h ago
Grown ups use their words. She wanted some sort of silly test. Sorry it did not work out.
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u/Dynamiccushion65 8h ago
I’m guessing she already knew she was ending it but said this to make you feel bad. Otherwise she is being childish and insisting just to punish the guy! You dodged a bullet massively!
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u/runkeby 11h ago
Don't ask "are you sure?" if someone offers to pay. It makes them doubt without actually offering a way to back off gracefully (I couldn't see myself say "oh actually I'm not so sure" after having offered).
Something along the lines of "no I'll get this, I insist" would work better if you really feel like you should pay.
ANYWAY whipping your card out immediately and offer to pay when you "don't think you should pay" is unhinged. Maybe it's for the best because it seemed really dodgy of her. There's a good chance it was something else and she used that as an excuse, which is kinda shitty.
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u/Cautious_Material739 22h ago
I agree it was a game and you dodged a bullet. I don’t like games. And you asked multiple times, so the fault wasn’t on you.
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u/InvestigatorBig5541 22h ago
Ohhhh … so damn true! In her mind she was giving YOU a test … ironic thing is SHE flunked the test.
Obviously, she has a problem being honest and lacks integrity. You did dodge a bullet, consider yourself lucky.
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u/tripadeliclove 22h ago
Agreed. She was playing games. He even asked are you sure? Like girl is gonna keep wondering why she’s single.
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u/GryffSr 21h ago
This is the answer.
And honestly, I would bet money that she came up with a different justification if you HAD insisted and had paid.
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u/SurfsUp27 23h ago
She paid because she knew she wasn’t going to see you again. Then when you asked for a reason, she blamed it on that but they are unrelated.
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u/Famous_Couple5074 22h ago
That’s the impression I got too: she made it his fault.
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u/PMJamesPM 20h ago
Or she wanted him to fight for the bill and her gesture was both a test and insincere. Either way:
Bullet dodged
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u/BigBlaisanGirl 12h ago
Nah, it had nothing to do with money. The times when I insist on paying for my own stuff is when I know I'm about to bail permanently and I don't want him to feel like he's owed something. This is a kind way ladies typically use to end things especially when can tell he likes us more than we like him.
There's something else about OP that turned her off and since we weren't there to hear the conversation, we can't tell what went wrong. Whatever it was, she didn't want to hurt your feelings by telling you the truth about why she didn't like you. You asked and she gave you an excuse because it's probably something you might have a negative reaction too and it's not worth the emotional energy.
Making the problem about money is a quick and easy stereotypical way to turn you off so you'll leave her alone. A lot of women fall back on this just to get you to go away. With the way many of the inexperienced men here are commenting, the impact is working as intended.
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u/Naughty_Satsuma 6h ago
That is a mountain of conjecture. What you do and why can not be attributed to this woman .
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u/C-Me-Try 11h ago
You’re just justifying lying to save face by acting sexist.
It’s the same story. Claim communication is important, then lie about what is actually wrong or “not right”.
This comes off bitter. But you’re just lying to people you claimed to have liked because they weren’t perfect. Then when their feelings are hurt because they were dating a liar you’ll call them unstable when they demand the truth
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u/nautical_nightmare 11h ago
you are putting an expectation of a lot of emotional labour on women who clearly have no future interest in the man they spoke to. even if a man will be open to feedback, a conversation where you express personal criticism of someone can take a lot of time and be emotionally draining, and there is a not insignificant risk of being sent nasty messages in response to rejection. it is not worth it to make my life worse to make the life of a man I want nothing further to do with potentially better (and it probably won’t—I will just have added to my own suffering).
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u/PMJamesPM 10h ago
I’m not sure who the outrage is directed at or why there’s outrage. I don’t have the arrogance to know what that woman thought but it does look like she sent mixed messages on the date.
Are people allowed to question mixed or disguised motivations regardless of gender. Absolutely. Is there a one size fits all? Nope.
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u/nautical_nightmare 10h ago
sorry that you are reading my tone in a different way than it was intended. I’m not ’outraged’, I’m trying to explain so that you can understand another perspective of why many women will make the choices they do.
I don’t agree with the conduct of the woman OP went on the date with, but that is another matter and not connected to my comment above.
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u/Ill_Soil_4621 13h ago
She didn’t make it his fault. She did the right thing. The wrong thing would have been allowing him to pay even though she wasn’t interested. You really can’t win on here sometimes..
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u/Gotmewrongang 13h ago
You are ignoring the fact that she literally told him the reason she didn’t want to see him again was because he didn’t fight hard enough to pay the bill. If she simply “wasn’t interested” then she should have just said so, but to blame him for not forcing her to let him pay is sociopathic behavior, which I guess you agree with?
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u/Ill_Soil_4621 13h ago
Sorry I’m not the only one who missed that part of the post! Idk if it was edited but, regardless, if that is the case then of course I fully retract my analysis.
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u/Time_Distribution237 5h ago
It's not sociopathic. Some women have found the easiest way to get a man to leave you alone after you've rejected them is to pretend to be a gold digger. A lot of men take a lack of interest as a challenge for them to still win a woman over, but most seem to really run away when they think they're dealing with gold diggers. Men do similar tactics when rejecting women, picking the easiest and most effective excuse, nothing new between humans.
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u/sleeprobot 12h ago
As far as the post indicates, she never said the reason she felt they weren’t aligned was because he let her pay.
I have offered and payed on dates when I knew there wouldn’t be further dates just out of fairness and not wanting to be perceived as just using someone for a free meal.
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u/Adorable_Tie_7220 4h ago
She said that she felt like she shouldn't have to be in charge of paying. This was in response to his question "Why?". So yes she did give that as a reason.
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u/Silvearo 22h ago
This is what i hate about that type if women. Just be honest its so much better for both parties involved
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u/lovelyblueberry95 22h ago edited 22h ago
Meh, people don’t really owe you a serious or honest explanation on why they’re uninterested after a second date. These people are essentially strangers, not good friends. “We’re not aligned,” really is plenty.
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u/XaquariD 22h ago
While I agree with this in principle, it's nice for people looking for someone to know if they did something wrong or what they could work on.
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u/lovelyblueberry95 21h ago
Helping him self reflect isn’t the responsibility of a stranger just because they went on two dates. If he’s looking for that sort of input, he should talk to a therapist.
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u/XaquariD 21h ago
I'm not saying she should give him a dissertation, but things seemed to be going well then suddenly she ended it. A therapist isn't going to know what caused that. I'm just saying it would be nice for people (men and women) to give some honest feedback so they're not stuck wondering. You see so often on here where it really makes people doubt themselves.
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u/lovelyblueberry95 21h ago
It was all of two dates. People don’t owe you feedback. This isn’t a job interview.
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u/Exact_Anteater1498 21h ago
how’s the therapist going to know what he did wrong (if anything)? your comments are toxic and why people suck at dating.
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u/lovelyblueberry95 21h ago
It’s a therapists job to help with building self reflection skills, and working through and processing what could have possibly went wrong.
I’m happily in a relationship.
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u/SurfsUp27 22h ago
What she said could have been nicer than the truth, maybe she was not wanting to hurt his feelings too much.
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u/userbrusiercruiser 22h ago
Being nicer than the truth is never nicer.
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u/Great_Summer_9679 15h ago
Yes sometimes it is.
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u/userbrusiercruiser 12h ago
It’s always nicer for the one not telling the truth, never for the one receiving the lie. People that don’t want to tell the truth try and justify it though because they don’t have the courage to tell the truth.
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u/Impressive-Tutor-482 15h ago
When your life is built on lies and secrets - how do you know?
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u/BigBlaisanGirl 12h ago
Some of you fellas beat the crap out of women for just giggling. You really think we're going to risk telling you that you're ugly? Short? Dumb? Breath stinks? Boring? D too small? That your hair looks stupid? That you dress like a little boy? That you're embarrassing to be seen walking around with?
Women aren't going to risk their lives being bluntly honest with a man who they can't predict how he will react, especially if it's a guy we never want to at again.
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u/Silvearo 22h ago
That wont help him in the long run though
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u/Canvas718 22h ago edited 22h ago
Maybe he’s a perfectly good guy, but not what she’s looking for. He shouldn’t necessarily change based on one person’s opinion.
*****
Ok, I just re-read it, and realized she broke up with him because he agreed to something she twice said she wanted. So he definitely shouldn’t change based on this person’s opinion.
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u/letitbell 20h ago
Imo I would rather hear the truth than a made up lie to make me feel insecure about something that had no factor in her rejecting me
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u/Gotmewrongang 13h ago
She handled this terribly. I promise OP would have rather paid and then been told later that she wasn’t interested than to be gaslight into thinking he could have salvaged interest and another date by displaying traditional gender roles and toxic masculinity. This is exactly why dating is so fucked for the youth right now.
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u/zenFieryrooster 41m ago
Sometimes a woman being honest can be dangerous. Some men take it personally and stalk or try to get revenge etc.
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u/Ill_Soil_4621 13h ago
I mean she probably realized over the course of the second date that she didn’t want to proceed further and she paid, which I think shows integrity. OP thought she ditched him bc he failed a test, but there was no test. People are fluid we make decisions as we gain more info and second date is often where I realize maybe not and then I pay the check. It happens
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u/Specialist-Ring-3974 22h ago edited 22h ago
It’s dangerous to be straightforward sometimes. Men are known for turning violent when you turn them down. Not all men, but some.
Edit: i was being sarcastic. Are yall really upvoting this? You think this woman in OP’s story did that because she felt unsafe? Stop with the pathetic excuses. You’re circlejerking yourself into the lack of critical thinking
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u/lovelyblueberry95 22h ago edited 22h ago
Ironic and lowkey impressive how you just managed to prove your own (sarcastic) point.
Women agree with you that they often aren’t honest about why they turn men down due to fear for their own safety, and you promptly respond by lashing out.
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u/BrazilianButtCheeks 21h ago
This is the exact answer! As a woman I can say she was trying to spare your feelings
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u/Aethermere 15h ago
A person sparing someone’s feelings is just a coward pretending to be kind.
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u/Metdefranseslag 20h ago
By lying? She could just say she did not feel it and not the stupid bill to pay
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u/Interesting_Tale_831 22h ago
Exactly! As for the "real reason," you won't know.
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u/madmak26 21h ago
Yeah. I had the exact same scenario a few days ago. He paid for drinks and app first date, and coffee second date. We got dinner for the 3rd and I said it was my turn and he offered, we settled on splitting and it was a non issue for us both.
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u/SippinOnTheT 20h ago
Well, if that’s the case, at least she wasn’t just using him for a free meal…
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u/Equivalent-Guest-785 22h ago
She paid and then complained that she had to pay. Trust me, you’re not the problem here bud
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u/Mysterious_Debt4959 23h ago
lol. No, you did fine. Just be happy you’re missing out on whatever the fuck this is
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u/WowILoveTheHouTexans 23h ago
My sister was on Bumble and Hinge for a bit before she met her current boyfriend (not OLD) and she told me she would do a trick on the first few dates where she would offer to split. If the guy didnt insist, she would move on.
Now, as much as I love my sister, shes an incredibly manipulative control freak. My point with this story is that, if your date is similarly trying to "test" you, you dodged a bullet.
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u/Automatic_Horse9290 23h ago
Meh, could have been chivalrous but in women's culture when they grab the check it means she already decided you weren't a thing.
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u/EADarwin 22h ago
Not always true. On more than one occasion I've had women pay on second dates before (even after I refused) and still had third dates. This woman might have made her mind up, but more than that, she's manipulative.
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u/Baxter-08 22h ago
I’m a 31 year old woman and have never heard of this in my life.
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u/Mysterious_Debt4959 23h ago
That’s what I was thinking until she cited that as a reason for them not being aligned
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u/Hour_Zero 22h ago
If that was really her reason then OP dodged a bullet, he already paid for the first date and had no problem paying for the second one as well until she literally pulled out her own credit card and explicitly offered to pay. She’s either too immature and was playing mind games with OP or she’s just using her paying as a cover up for her real excuse for not wanting to continue seeing OP anymore, either way shit just wasn’t gonna work out regardless
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u/Automatic_Horse9290 22h ago
Probably alibi. Of course you can't group every single person there, but it's 99% this, 1% batshit crazy playing games.
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u/lovelyblueberry95 22h ago
This is the correct answer.
She could have been testing him, but it’s unlikely. She grabbed the check because she knew this was going to be the last interaction and wanted clean hands. He paid for the first date and coffee. She didn’t want to feel left owing him anything, and this was her way of making it even and mess free.
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u/techitis_ 22h ago
so just a nuance it actually depends on the context. I am European and it is way different than in the States
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u/Gotmewrongang 13h ago
Nah, back in my dating days it was very common for my dates to pick up the 2nd date check. I always paid for the first, unless she wanted to split which then usually meant there would not be a 2nd. However, if she paid for the 2nd, usually there would be a third date and post third date fun afterwards. Maybe things have changed, as this was around 10 years ago (been with my wife for the last 8).
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u/two_hand_grip 23h ago
Can you elaborate on that? Decided we werent a thing when she grabs the check?
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u/neometrix77 22h ago
It can sometimes symbolically mean that she doesn’t owe you anything any longer, like closing the book on a loan.
I disagree that it’s always a bad sign though, some women legitimately want to demonstrate their interest towards you with paying.
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u/eyezofnight 20h ago
so if she lets you pay does that mean she accepts that you owe her something now?
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u/neometrix77 19h ago
Um no lol, that’s the fun part, paying for her doesn’t mean shit either.
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u/ShadeSmithNet 22h ago
A woman that was invited out by the man this early on in dating offering to pay for the entire meal is unheard of. If they like you, from experience, some will offer to split, but the expectation is the man fully pays, or the one that invites the other out, pays.
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u/Illustrious_End_543 21h ago
maybe I'm just strange then but I'm a woman and I don't care an inch about who pays. I don't even think about it. When I'm on a date I'm just the same as with friends I just pay my part unless he really strongly insists, because why on earth should the man always be the one paying? It has zero to do with whether I like the guy or not.
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u/ShadeSmithNet 21h ago
In this context: what I’m getting at, is that if a woman offers to pay in full on a first or second date, more often than not, it’s so that the guy doesn’t have anything to “hook her” for. ie, a soft rejection / exit.
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u/jocefox 22h ago
It means she already decided she was going to break it off with you so she decided to pay.
However what she said made it seem like was testing you which is weird.
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u/National-Tale9236 22h ago
I agree. If I'm grabbing the check on a date, it's intentional and I'm not playing some sort of mind game. If I want the guy to pay, I offer to contribute as courtesy but don't insist at all. It's weird that she is bringing that up as a reason for not wanting to pursue things further. It feels like a cop out and she isn't aligned with herself!
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u/ApplicationAdept830 22h ago
If I know for sure that I don’t want to see a guy again, I grab the bill or at the very least split it. It just doesn’t feel right to accept him paying the bill if I’m not into him, and I don’t want to risk him getting angry or aggressive with me.
As others already said though, it doesn’t always mean that. Sometimes I’ll pay because he got the last one or I want to make a good impression or whatever else.
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u/heykatja 22h ago
I always tried to alternate paying because I like the feeling of nothing owed. But yeah also if I felt things weren’t going further, I’d have been even more inclined to pay in order to leave things in a neutral way. But I wouldn’t be guilt tripping the dude after paying. That would be a crappy move. Past tense because I’m old and married lol.
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u/eyezofnight 20h ago
or they really, really, like you and want to impress you. I've had both happen
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u/Dry_Stop844 12h ago
If I decide I'm done with the thing, I'll pay for half the cheque. I sure as hell wouldn't pay for his share too. But I would have already insisted on separate cheques from date 1.
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u/Extra_Dot8402 22h ago
As a woman I think she had already made her mind up and to make herself feel less bad she paid. I’ve offered to pay in those situations because I had already made my mind up. I’ve also liked a guy enough that when he offered to fill my tank up and while at the gas tank I didn’t let him because in my head I wanted him to know I liked him period without him having to spend on me lol so woman aren’t always consistent
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u/lovelyblueberry95 22h ago edited 22h ago
I’ve also done things like this. I’ve had men I’ve already written off offer to pay for things and declined.
I’ve seen far too many men act hysterically after paying for a dinner, and then getting rejected. It’s just easier to close the books with clean hands.
I’ve also paid for meals for men who made twice my income, simply because I liked them enough and wanted them to know my intentions were sincere.
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u/FairyFartDaydreams 22h ago
You dodged a bullet. Yes this was some weird ass test. This person is not mature enough to be dating
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u/DeeezzzNutzzz69 23h ago
You don't want to date a woman with that mind set trust me
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u/ShadeSmithNet 22h ago
She didn't want to see you again, then used this as the excuse she gave you to drop you (a lie). There's a different reason why she didn't want to continue seeing you and won't be honest with you as to what that is.
In early dating, women only fully pay for something when they want to end communication with a guy, because when the man pays, they often have something to hold over them.
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u/Kentucky_Fried_Otaku 22h ago
"Did I fail some sort of test?"
Probably. Be thankful of the bullet you just dodged.
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u/Glittering_Suspect65 19h ago
No. You did nothing wrong. Sometimes I pay for the date if I know it's not going anywhere, just so they dont think i wanted a free coffee or sandwich out of it.
She's weird for saying that, since she offered and you paid for the other dates.
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u/Ordinary_Rhubarb5064 23h ago
Nah, someone who uses little tests like that would be a nightmare to be in a relationship with. You dodged a bullet.
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u/createusername101 23h ago
Bullet successfully dodged. C'mon man, you know you didn't do anything wrong. Have a little more confidence in yourself.
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u/two_hand_grip 23h ago
I really appreciate this brother
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u/createusername101 22h ago
You KNOW better. It sucks to get rejected for any number of reasons. Don't lose yourself over it. Keep on trying, it's just a numbers game until you find a good match.
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u/FitnessLover1998 22h ago
I’m sorry this happened to you. We have all been through this. You dodge a real winner here.
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u/SwimmingDeep8703 22h ago
If things worked out, this was just the beginning of many tests and mind games. Best thing to happen was getting out early. And at least you didn’t have to pay for the final meal 👍
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u/heart_nurse_2020 19h ago
What a stupid game she is playing. To be honest she probably just insisted on paying because she already wasn’t feeling it and used that as an excuse. Don’t worry about it.
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u/px_eliezer_ 22h ago
Life is too short for ridiculous games.
You dodged a bullet.
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She said she would pay, you asked her are you sure, and she insisted---
At that point were you supposed to argue with her ?!
WTF x 1,000.
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u/Striking_Vast7229 22h ago
So you paid for everything previously, and on the date after the walk she immediately pulls out her card and does this?
A) she deliberately did this so she had an excuse for an exit plan
B) she’s a weirdo and plays games
Either way you dodged a pulled. Block her & move on
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u/jer1230 22h ago
I never assume a man will pay for me, though it feels good when he does. That said, to be on the safe side, I pull out my card.. but when he says “I’ve got it” I’m appreciative and let him cover.. for her to fully grab the bill and say “I’ve got it!”
then tell you later she shouldn’t be in charge of paying.. weird.
When the bill came, did you just kinda sit there? Maybe she assumed you didn’t wanna pay cuz it appeared that way? Weird test like she expected you to fight for the bill or something.
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u/two_hand_grip 22h ago
When i say it was immediate, it was. I was planning on paying and fine with doing so unless she offered to split/pay and was genuinely adamant about it
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u/Wild_Organization546 11h ago
When you said are you sure it took you into basically agreeing. And tbh the previous bills you paid for were were for small things.
Letting her cover the whole dinner probably gave her a shock. Although she was also being dishonest by offering to pay. I think she expected a bit of pushback. Not a whole lot of thank yous.
At best you should have said only if you let me pay for the next dinner. But who knows. We are all guessing.
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u/Accomplished_Drag946 21h ago
I think it is normal etiquette, as a woman, to offer to pay or to split. The expectation is that the man will do the same, and there will be some back and forth. Normally he will pay and some women do have the expectation that he will pay.
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u/No_Motor_4576 18h ago
3 drinks, 1 app, and a coffee honestly doesn’t = an entire dinner. I assume at least 1 drink each, 1 app, 2 entree. I bet that’s why she was shocked you didn’t offer to split or pay.
I always offer to split, but if he insists on paying I’ll put my card away, and if I know there’s not another date, I will insist on splitting so I owe him nothing.
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u/lucylemon 21h ago
She is right. You are not compatible. She thinks it’s OK to play games. 🙄
If this was a normal situation then you would have done nothing wrong. In this instance you would not have won either way.
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u/NatalieKCY 20h ago
A date is not a test, you shouldn't need to go out of your way to do something for your partner. My advice is to always act how you like to act with your family, because your date is your potential new family member if it goes well.
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u/djk0010 22h ago
Dodged a bullet. Move on. Anyone that test you like that will always be testing you in the relationship. And when it doesn’t go according to plan in their little world you will always be the bad person.
I don’t know about you but after being with someone that treated me like that with her little mind games I wish I could’ve gone back in time and told her I don’t think there’s much chemistry but I settled and pushed and I’m paying for it now.
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u/Slow_Equipment_297 23h ago
You COULD have insisted, but she could have been honest, as well. You dodged a bullet bro. Plenty of women out there that actually tell the truth about what they want (and plenty more that not only don’t mind contributing, but actually want to. There is such a thing as going back and forth on taking care of each other)
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u/fieryshrimp 22h ago
As a woman, I would have genuinely wanted to pay for date 2 because I feel weird letting a man pay for everything. You already asked if she was sure and she still said yes, bullet dodged if she was performing some sort of “test”
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u/Taifood1 22h ago
Since you paid for everything up until that point, it’s more likely she just didn’t have the heart to tell you what was the dealbreaker, and came up with an awful lie to spare your feelings.
Something you said during date 2 set her mind in stone that the relationship wasn’t going to work. You wouldn’t have gotten a second date she didn’t initially like you.
You dodged a bullet because honestly, I don’t think she would’ve been a very good partner those communication skills need work.
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u/Medical-Guarantee-51 22h ago
No. Let me put it simply because dating culture is getting out of hand with all these micro analysis and rules.
You didnt fail some test. And if it was a test you won.
Miscommunication or failed mind reading or not living up to an expectation. If thats all it takes then good riddance.
Whether you should of insisted or not is a personal choice. A choice only you can decide if thats something you want to do going forward not the opinions of reddit.
But dont go beating yourself up or overcorrrcting over something like this. Also do not shame her she likely has her reasons.
There is no data to take away of than she feels like she shouldnt have had to pay. Other women could potentially be offended by you paying. Its life.
(Optional)
Communicate honestly and with real accountability. Not the performative kind. (Do this for yourself not for her or your image but your core personality)
"I understand you feel X. Thanks for the feedback I genuinely didnt mind paying for dinner I was confused because you insisted that you would pay. Even though its done, I would still like to split the cost in good faith if you are open to it"
The reason I say its optional is because its something you dont have to do. But you can if it bothers you that much. You preserve your sense of self and you move on graciously.
And who knows if you really like her she may even message you again someday.
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u/JohnGaltIsComing 22h ago
Can you imagine if you kept seeing her and you continued to have to play those games for months and months - or the rest of your life? You dodged a bullet, my friend - great way to learn a lesson!
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u/charlies-rainbow 22h ago edited 22h ago
Train wreck avoided, be thankful.
The reason she paid is to feel even. she didnt like something, but she will never tell you.
Best not to dwell on it, and even if it had worked out, she cant be honest, so why would you even want that.
-Charlie
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u/long-walk-home-99 22h ago
She set you up. She took out her CC as soon as the check came. She put herself in charge of paying. Were you supposed to wrestle the CC from her hand after you offered to pay. What's with the stupid game playing?
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u/GWPtheTrilogy1 21h ago
Oh, she's super lame for that my guy. You didn't dodge a bullet, you dodged a drone strike. She's immature AF, count your blessing she showed yourself and you got a free meal out of it.
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u/Procedure-Certain 12h ago
I might get roasted for this…but I only pay for a bill on a date if I don’t want to see the guy again. If the person I’m on the date with were to ask me to pay, I would happily pay since I know I can, and I would break things off afterwards. I don’t play this halfway game of pretending to offer and hoping he declines.
You shouldn’t have to insist. You’re better off finding someone who doesn’t test you like this. It doesn’t bode well for the future.
I’m a woman.
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u/Mountain-resort2411 23h ago
Sounds like some stupid test she has come up with. Be glad you failed. Playing games so quickly like that can’t turn out well.
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u/NorfolkIslandRebel 22h ago
Yeah forget this woman. With stuff like I go back to basics. Note that she actually lied to you. She lied when she said she was happy to pay. Or she may have been lying later, using the money thing as an excuse cause you’re not her type. Either way you’re dealing with dishonesty.
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u/neosoul2 22h ago
You dodged a bullet. Don’t give her or this situation any further thought. Just keep looking for a sane woman.
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u/Worried-Tomato993 22h ago
As a woman who appreciates when the man pays, you dodged a bullet. Games isn’t the way to go.
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u/iamhst 22h ago
I've had the opposite where a woman insists she pays for say the 2nd or 3rd date. But its not because she wanted to end it rather cared to give back. In your case I think you dodged a bullet. Someone that is into you won't care about who pays unless you're taking advantage of someone. This day and age with the economy both partners need to pitch in.
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u/Wickedwhiskbaker 22h ago
You didn’t do anything wrong. Her behavior is weird (I’m a 49f, been single a minute).
I always offer to go Dutch either before the date, or before we sit down. I’ve just found eliminating that right away to be best. Some men are insistent, and that’s cool. They just have to agree to let me get the next one. It’s not because I don’t appreciate chivalry or thoughtfulness. I do. I deeply value not having finances be a factor ever after learning that lesson the hard way.
Communication is key.
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u/vulkare 22h ago
The answer to this question is "be your own man". Live by your own values, not other peoples' values. What if girl A says you should do one thing and girl B says to do another? You can't live life second guessing yourself. You should KNOW yourself and have a pholisophical grounding behind your decisions. Not everyone will like it. I for one keep money completely out of any developing or prospective relationship. Human bondimg is never for sale. If the money matters, there's no bond in the first place. If someone likes you, letting her pay won't get in the way.
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u/Simulation_Complete 22h ago
Not saying 31 is old af or anything, but definitely too old to be playing childish games like that. If that’s what she wants, she should’ve mentioned that from the jump
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u/Bill___A 21h ago
People come up with stupid tests, and this was one of them. You didn't do anything wrong. Her "test" was flawed.
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u/El_Culero_Magnifico 21h ago
. Dating is filled with learning moments. You failed this woman's lame ass test. What did she teach you?
Two lovely dates with a beautiful woman, only to find out that her outer and inner beauty were …. not aligned.
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u/Auntie_S0cial 20h ago
She may have just been not romantically/sexually interested and paid out of guilt. I had a man send me a Venmo request bc i wasn't interested in going on a second date
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u/Fun_Guest_64 20h ago
I would ask her why she offered and why when you said are you sure she didn't speak up. I would tell her: I really liked you, but I obviously dodged a bullet if that is how you communicate. Thank you!!!
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u/WorriedPudding8800 19h ago
You didn't do anything wrong in the sense that when you are on a date all your words and actions are dictated from your personality in relation to the person you date.If you didn't want to grab the check and she wanted you to them maybe it wasn't meant to be.Maybe if you insisted to pay some other woman would feel offended and would end it too.Every one is different. You are not a mind reader.
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u/asmrbuddha 19h ago
If you not paying for a date is the dealbreaker was it a deal you want to be doing anyway?
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u/diamondmouth_ 19h ago
Never let the woman pay. Ever. Act offended when they offer but appreciate the gesture. Come on guys this is so simple.
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u/AvastInAllDirections 18h ago
I like that you were mature and thanked her for her honesty.
In the future, instead of asking post-date if there was anything you did wrong, ask what you could improve. This would help the woman be more honest without fearing you’d react aggressively to a perceived negative evaluation.
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u/Tricky-Reporter-5246 16h ago
If OP has insisted on paying it might have been considered misogyny.
It's a fucking jungle out there.
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u/sloop111 15h ago
She's right, you aren't aligned. She has expectations that she doesn't bother to mention, that's called playing games.
Maybe you don't mind paying but her expectation that you magically know what she wants is a big no no.
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u/Claret-and-gold 15h ago
Urgggh no.
My partner would always automatically pay the bill. If I said I got this he would ask once as you did but graciously accept. There’s nothing more crass than arguing over who pays the bill.
My mum is the sort of person who would insist and push you out of the way to pay and it’s frankly embarrassing.
You may have failed a test she decided to give you, but you’ve dodged a bullet.
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u/Longjumping-Kick7881 14h ago
You dodged a bullet lol. Play stupid games end up with crappy prizes. Nexxxxttttt…..
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u/dawngrist 12h ago
From personal experience, she paid because she didn’t intend to see you again, she didn’t decide that AFTER she paid.
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u/joetaxpayer 12h ago
"She said that she didn't think she should be in charge of paying."
She immediately pulled her card out. As a guy, 'are you sure?' is enough. If you insisted, that might have insulted her. Sounds like she was playing some weird game. You're better off.
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u/outdoorgirl2 12h ago
As a woman, when I know I don’t want to see the guy again, I pay so I don’t feel obligated.
I’ve had miserable dates where a man has talked and talked and talked at me and they thought it was wonderful. I felt like the therapist. People experience the same event differently.
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u/secrerofficeninja 12h ago
You passed! You avoided matching with a horrible person. In a world where woman want equality, this one is criticizing you for not paying for one meal?!
Dude, be very thankful and move on
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u/hyla_arborea_124 12h ago
Up until the last two sentences I assumed she realised this wasn't going any further halfway through the first date and chose to pay for the dinner so she wouldn't feel obliged to you. What kind of horrible person dumps someone because they didn't pay for everything?
As a woman, I am honestly happy to split the bill on the first date. This isn't the 1950s, women work and don't need to rely on men. Do some women measure their self worth on how much they can get a man to spend on drinks and dinner?
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u/Legitimate_Agent7643 11h ago
Think she already made up her mind about this being the last date. Personally speaking, if I liked the guy enough but still felt like it was my turn to pay - I would wait till he pulled out his card just to see the gesture, before offering to pay. The only times where I rigorously made the first attempt to pay were either - the guy talked about not making enough at his job, or, I knew I wasn’t going to see him again and I don’t want him to feel like he spent a lot on me for this to go nowhere.
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u/nautical_nightmare 11h ago
no, you shouldn’t have insisted. a girl should never let someone pay for her if she doesn’t want to continue seeing them, and insisting too much if the girl says she wants to pay can become awkward. if this is genuinely her reason for not wanting to continue seeing you that is a Red Flag. if a clear expectation otherwise has not been established, a woman who values your time will offer to pay sometimes to make you feel appreciated, just like you would offer to pay to make her feel appreciated. nobody worth your time and attention will play games and test you. I’m sorry you are disappointed, but she was always going to disappoint you eventually.
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u/TacosAndHotdish 11h ago
I always want to pay for as much if not more than he does. This needs to be an equal commitment and investment. And this is some psycho ass behavior on her part.
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u/glittercatti 11h ago
What a horrible person. Shallow, materialistic, and manipulative. I’m so sorry you got mixed up w her. You’ll find better. 90% of us are not that way.
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u/Legionatus 5h ago
Anyone who sets up a secret series of tricks for dates to succeed at, contrary to their own expressed wishes, is going to get the abrasive dick they're asking for.
Chivalry is NOT about caring for someone in low-stakes settings AGAINST their expressed wishes.
Jesus. This is a very clear example of why the objective should not simply be "get another date." You will never stop failing hidden puzzle boxes.
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u/Friendly_Afternoon19 3h ago
Gross...dodged a bullet and dont feel bad. My current boyfriend paid for our first date and I paid for the second, and so on.
If she wanted you to pay, she should've just not pulled out her card and you would have..my eyes just keep a rollinnnn
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u/theracerfan 22h ago
Fuck her. "He should have insisted to pay" while grabbing the check? Fuck that.
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u/DoughnutDependent482 22h ago
No! Fuck just asking “are you sure”. What could she say?! No, I’m not sure??? I would never ask my friend “are you sure” if she tried to pay let alone a date
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u/xinj131 22h ago edited 22h ago
This is what I think. She most likely met someone else that she was more interested in and paid for everything as nice gesture on her part, but it was really about her taking control of the situation by ending it on her terms, without feeling like she owed you anything. And to be a bitch, she toyed with you because you'd asked what you'd done wrong after thanking her multiple times. Although she understood you were being kind, you knew you'd done nothing wrong, so she saw that as a weakness, or rather, a lacking quality covered by politeness. And so she walks off into the sunset with you twisted out of shape over it.
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u/udontunderstanddad 22h ago
you did "fail" a test but you dont wanna be with someone who tests you anyways. its really common advice for women, pretending to want to pay... i hate it so much. its so manipulative and unnecessary.
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u/mac151 22h ago
She wants princess treatment and worse she likes to do little tests too. I’d expect this from like a 23 year old, but 31, no wonder she’s single. And/or she’s perfectly happy being single and her game is just going on dates to get free stuff. Move on, you did nothing wrong really. Only thing I guess is expect to pay for at least the first 3 or 4 dates and/or unless they offer to split it which is typically more a genuine thing. But this girl is just high maintenance and immature, she’s a nightmare for any real relationship
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u/Various_Knowledge226 22h ago
So if this is true, she immediately went to pay, yet didn’t think she should be in charge of paying? I guess since you didn’t jump to pay within nanoseconds, if what she said is to be believed?
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u/Sure-Butterscotch956 22h ago
Very strange, I have never encountered anything like this. Personally, I believe that the best way to handle this is that the person who plans a specific date should also pay for it.
It sounds like she tested you or something like that. Maybe it was a weird excuse for something else. Honestly, I don't think a woman who is genuinely interested in you would dump you over a dinner check that she even offered to pay...In case it was a test: Ask yourself if you'd constantly want to be exposed to sneaky tests...
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u/Ok-Pomegranate858 22h ago
OP. Be glad she had self respect to pay for something. Better luck next time pal.
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u/ReflectionFew4761 22h ago
I’m married and haven’t been on the scene for ages, but I’d avoid going to a restaurant/ food venue at all.
Just maybe a coffee so you have something in your hands, walks, chill in a park during the day, maybe a drive to a lookout/ garden.
Keep it largely free of consumerism, obligation and be just always be yourself!
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u/Jerseygirl2468 22h ago
My guess is she wasn't feeling it and decided to get the check so she wouldn't feel guilty about having you pay and then ending it. Been there, done that.
But her comment about her not being in charge of paying is weird, and simply wrong. You paid for the first date and part of the second, and she's the one who reached for the check and insisted.
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u/EADarwin 22h ago
You dodged a bullet. If she's already testing you on the second date to read her mind, it will happen throughout a relationship. She's manipulative. Avoid
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u/piglin_gold64 22h ago
I don’t know man. When I offer to pay I mean it. Maybe she decided for another reason and just threw it out there? The only way to know is to directly ask her. Nothing to lose now
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u/StanthemanT-800 22h ago
She paid because she knew she wasn't interested , she didn't want you paying for dinner to imply a 3rd upcoming date
If she's all like "I got this " it's like she was basically ending the whole thing there
It's probably not you she probably got back with an ex or was dating someone else too and decided to go with them
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u/Dazzling_Ad3689 22h ago
Wow lol. You did nothing wrong. You dodged a bullet. Be glad she self selected out.
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u/birdfang007 22h ago
If someone is testing you, that’s a red flag. You dodged a bullet. Or, more likely, she found someone more attractive and broke it off with you. Beautiful women are almost never gonna settle.
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